And you, Performance Center?

[Milton]

Hi I am a new user, long time browser, silent user.

The situation begins:

I bought a Smith and Wesson Performance Center revolver, and it was terrible! Metal shards were sticking out of the forcing cone, the rear sight was loose, the barrel was cut at an angle suitable for downhill skiing and the trigger jerked like an old gate.

I sent it back to S&W, and although they polished out some of the rougher areas of the forcing cone, they only admitted to replacing the rear sight.

(It also took them three weeks to admit that they had the wrong serial # entered in their computer)

I took it to my gunsmith and he took it apart in front of me. The forcing cone was still cut at a bad angle, and the internals of the sideplate looked like S&W had a two year old take it apart. I am the original owner and know only S&W had ever taken it apart.

I want results:

Not wanting S&W to touch my revolver again, I ask my gunsmith to save the gun.

We decide on the following:

1. New trigger, wider trigger.
2. New grips, he thought I was joking that the 629-Vcomp came with the block grips. The only point where we disagreed, I like the Eagle classic, he likes another brand.
3. New match heavy bbl.
4. Two new locking points, so there will be a four point lockup vs. the standard two.
5. Action work (V-Comp had a trigger worse than a RG9)

Yet to come:

NP3 finish from Robar.

I will post the results of this work when completed for anyone who is interested. I am confident this will be as good as the S&W New Century model from years past. The way a revolver should be built, and will help the further the development of the great equalizer.

I think this will prove to be very interesting, although I am selling a box full of pre-ban magazines to pay for it.

The final question:

And you, Performance Center? ...This was the unkindest cut of them all.

 

[WESHOOT2]

HOPE YOUR 'SMITH IS GOOD

NP3......mmmmmmm good.

Hope your S&W turns out the way you like; sorry the Performance Center sucked.
Suprised by that.......

 

[Kermit]

From what I've seen of recent PC guns (ironic ) the quality control is slipping. I had some experience w/ an older 45 acp pistol of theirs. To say the gun was sweet would be an understatement. Last year, a buddy picked up a new one and it just seemed like a standard production piece.
Sounds like you've got your own custom revolver on its way. Good luck, welcome to the board & keep us informed on how your project turns out.

 

[Tamara]

The Ole Gray Mare...

...her QC ain't what it used to be.

I had to have the hand filed down and the star fit on my 296Ti.

I know how you feel. If I'm going to have to do trigger work and such out of the box, why buy a $500 or $900 revolver when I can buy a $300 or $400 one?


I'd love to see project reports, as I have a real soft spot in my head... er, heart for N-frames.

 

[ViLLain]

Milton

You appear to be knowledgeable in what makes a fine firearms. So why waste $900 on a Performance Center gun, to then spend another $1000 on custom smithing?

Gabriel

 

[C.R.Sam]

welcome Milton.

Personal opinion, you let em off the hook too early. With that kind of investment and subsequent treatment I would have gone through assorted management people untill satisfied.

On the other hand, maby that is your punishment for buying a post agreement gun from them.

Please keep us posted on the progress of your project gun. Sounds very interesting.

Sam

 

[mec]

PC= Production Center?

Could be they are consentrating more on turning out quantities of special editions more than on QC. My heritage 24 is a good piece of work. Fine fit and finish and everything lines up well enough to produce 1" 25 yard groups. It didn't however come with a finely tuned action. A lot of non PC guns are better out of the box. Had to be shot 2-3 hundred rounds to smooth in and the factory trigger was about 6 pounds. All I did to it was shoot it and take one coil off the trigger return to make a real S&W out of it.

By contrast, I recently had a smith custom engraved which involved dissassembly and a thorough inspection. When it came back, it was equipped with forged corbon trigger and hammer replacing what looked like case hardened stainless parts. The gunsmith who did the work on it was a Smith employee but the customer rep told me that he wasn't part of the performance center. Rep said she had total faith in him. Totally right too. The action is excellent.

 

[Fatelvis]

I bought one of thier PC "special" model 629`s, with the OD colored frame, and Black-T (I think)cylinder. It shot great, but after just one firing session, as I cleaned the exterior, using Shooters Choice, and a rag, and the black was coming off! It was stainless underneath, and I asked if they could just strip it down to bare stainless, but they said no. They did, however, refund my money promptly. Great looking/shooting gun, but lousy "Birdsong" finish!

 

[Milton]

I am visiting my gunsmith tomorrow. He just finished building a different 629 that thinks I would like, and at the least it will give more input on my revolver.

What I would really want would be a custom gun built on a square butt frame.

If this project works well, I want another revolver built with the same quad-lockup in .38spl.

More news to come...

 

[dewey]

Mine ? OK

Although my actions haven/t been up to par overall I'm pleased with the 3 PC guns I purchased this year. The last one was produced in May, a 625PC(Camfour)with the 5 1/4" brrl. The action was so outstanding I called S&W and spoke to a mgr in the PC dept. and he said they had "Put ALOT of work into those guns !" Does that mean some of the others were NOT smoothed so well? When I asked about the SA pull on my 629PC and why it was 4 1/2 lbs. he said that was a directive.(I had already worked it to 3.)
If they come out with anymore I like I'll prolly buy them.

I had ordered 2 Heritage guns but cancelled them as $900+ is TOO much. I believe this price is more Lew Horton's doing than Smiths. best....dewey

 

[Milton]

Gave it up

I traded the PC for a tuned gun my gunsmith had made. Then latersomeone else brought in another Performance center gun.

I went to the other gunshop I frequent, and there was another Performance center handgun that was brought back. The gap on it was also terrible.

Therefore I am learning to shoot automatics, that aren't S&W.

 

[Torpedo]

But what a shame to pay the price for a Preformance Center Gun and get a shoddy piece of work. Those guns aren't cheap. And now your going to spend all that money to fix S&W's mistakes. Wouldn't be me. I send it back and demand a new gun and if they sent me another lemon I'd have to get a lawyer and see if we couldn't make there lives a little more miserable. Or just get your money back and buy a used model and then let your smith fix it up for you. Just seems that there isn't as much pride left in Made In America these days. It's a sin cause it doesn't have to be that way. Just my .02.

 

[bountyh]

Based on what I've read (and the model 66 I bought about a year ago), SW quality is not being as well controlled as it used to be. You might want to send a thank you note to the boycotters for that. SW's financial records were made public some time back and they were in deep s**t even before the boycott. Liabilities exceeded assets my many millions. That means lenders will charge a lot more for loans and the company has a deeper hole to dig itself out of because it has to pay off all that interest. I have personally worked at companies in that predicament and the first casualty is always quality. You ship anything that works (in this case, shoots) because you are desperate for short term revenue. I hope they get back to where they were but I'm not sure I'd buy one of their guns in the next year.

 

[Gunaholic]

bountyh, you are right about this being directly tied to boycotters. That's why I'm not participating in the boycot and it pisses my off every time I hear or read people saying "don't buy new S&W". If we the people run S&W out of business it puts us on the same boat all these antigun politicians are on. How much better will that make us than them? I don't understand why people can't see this is exactly what these politicians want and the trick is working. They would be delighted to see S&W go belly up. I don't want to see S&W fall off the face of the earth. They make some of the best revolvers out there and they're a huge part of our history. Think about what you're really doing when you boycot.

 

[444]

I am an active boycotter, however I have purchased 4-5 beautiful pinned and recessed Smiths in the last year. Unfortunatly I also paid the big bucks for a 627PC. It is OK. It doesn't have any glaring problems. The action is not nearly as smooth as the standard production Smiths I own. It exhibits about the same accuracy as the standard production guns I own. It offers nothing to justify four times the price other than the aluminum brief case that comes with it.
I read the article in Gun Tests about the new Triple Locks and the new 1917. I would love to have them, but based on my experience with the 627PC, I am not going to pay $1100 for it. Besides, I am a boycotter.
Yes, I have thought about this boycott long and hard for what ? a couple years ? I don't buy into your argument.

 

[adk]

Things must be different than they were a couple years ago when I knocked a 629 44mag out of line with loads that exceeded the S&W specs for the gun. I told them what I'd done, but they fixed it for free anyway, and pretty fast. And that was a production gun, not Performance Center. I did get politely chewed out by the lady gunsmith, and I promised her I wouldn't do it again. adk

 

[SamC]

Gunaholic says "Think about what you're really doing when you boycot."

I am thinking about what I'm doing by boycotting $&$. It's $&$ that didn't think what THEY were doing, and attempting to do, when they signed on with Slick Willy and his cronies. $&$ was attempting to get an inside track to more gun sales at other manufacturers expense and, more importantly, at the expense of the rights of U.S. gunowners. I should consider, or think about, them? Not in a million @#$#@ years! Traitors, nothing more. SamC

 

[Tamara]

We have exceeded our quota of pro- and anti-boycott posts in this thread. Please keep subsequent posts in this thread about the handuns, and discuss politics in the Legal & Political Forum.

Thank you for your cooperation.

 

[Mark IV Series 80]

I recently had a smith custom engraved which involved dissassembly and a thorough inspection. When it came back, it was equipped with forged corbon trigger and hammer replacing what looked like case hardened stainless parts. The gunsmith who did the work on it was a Smith employee but the customer rep told me that he wasn't part of the performance center. Rep said she had total faith in him. Totally right too. The action is excellent.

The hammers and triggers on new S&W's are MIM (Metal Injection Molded). The MIM parts are less expensive to produce, and don't have the strength of the carbon steel parts.
If you send your new revolver to the S&W performance Center for a custom action job, they will replace the MIM trigger and hammer with a carbon steel trigger and hammer.

My 15 year-old M66 has the flash-chrome plated, carbon steel, hammer and trigger and the overall quality is excellent.
The newer S&W's just don't have the same quality as the older ones. If I needed another revolver, I woud look at Ruger or try to find an older S&W in good condition.