accurate load ?
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ShootistPRS
New member
It is likely that it will be accurate within the same MOA accuracy that you are getting at 100 yards but the only way to know is to shoot it at the longer ranges.
Interesting.
I don't know much about long range/rifle shooting. I'm a handgun guy.
But it seems to me, if you're shooting just under 1" groups at 100 yards; that'd translate to just under 2" groups at 200 yards; and just under 3" groups at 300 yards. Assuming the bullet remains stable (sufficient twist, etc.)
There's probably some things I don't know here.
I don't know much about long range/rifle shooting. I'm a handgun guy.
But it seems to me, if you're shooting just under 1" groups at 100 yards; that'd translate to just under 2" groups at 200 yards; and just under 3" groups at 300 yards. Assuming the bullet remains stable (sufficient twist, etc.)
There's probably some things I don't know here.
The difference between 100 yards and 200/300 yards is more than just the Rifle or Bullet but the most important factor the shooter . You may be up to shooting well at 100 yd the only way to know anything past that is do it .
Do not forget drop the 223 really goes south after 150 yards .
Do not forget drop the 223 really goes south after 150 yards .
When you can keep your 5-10 shot groups at 1" at 100 Yds. I believe Theoretically at 200 Yds. the group doubles to 2" since you doubled the distance. But at 300 Yds. the theoretic group would be 400 Yds. ... But that's the way I understand the way it goes. Perhaps we can get some one to help to assure correctness.
The 223 is commonly a light bullet and the BC isn't very high. Although with the correct fast twist you should be able to stabilize a heavier bullet with a higher BC to maximize the .224 diameter bullet.
Either way a 10> MPH wind can make a big difference in bullet flight. If you are using a 12 power scope and you can shoot without flinching from a bench you should be able to see the bullet flight. If you have a bright sun to show the reflection off the bullet.
The heavier the bullet the better BC the better the wind can be bucked.
That's where the ol Kentucky windage comes in.
I'm hoping for some one to comment please.
The 223 is commonly a light bullet and the BC isn't very high. Although with the correct fast twist you should be able to stabilize a heavier bullet with a higher BC to maximize the .224 diameter bullet.
Either way a 10> MPH wind can make a big difference in bullet flight. If you are using a 12 power scope and you can shoot without flinching from a bench you should be able to see the bullet flight. If you have a bright sun to show the reflection off the bullet.
The heavier the bullet the better BC the better the wind can be bucked.
That's where the ol Kentucky windage comes in.
I'm hoping for some one to comment please.
mikejonestkd
New member
Huh? please don't let the guys that use 223 at long range know that!!
a gun that shoots well at 100 yards will also shoot well at longer ranges, as long as the bullet remains stable.
MOST of the time you'll get the same MOA as range increases out to 200 or 300 yards at least in calm wind. A 1" group at 100 USUALLY means 2" at 200 and about 3" at 300. If you're getting 1.5" at 100, expect 3" at 200 and around 4.5" at 300. At some point you'll not have enough scope to see the target clearly enough to actually aim at the exact same point every time and you see MOA increase. The skill of the shooter comes into play as well. In gusty winds groups will increase as well as wind blows some bullets farther from POA.
It wouldn't be unusual to see MOA improve at longer ranges, but not actual group sizes. I've had rifles that would do no better than 1" at 100 yards, but were consistently under 2" at 200. In the 1.5-1.75" range and around 2.5" or better at 300.
This is one of those things debated hotly on the internet. I don't know the exact reason, there are lots of theories. But I've observed it as have too many others to discount it as myth.
It wouldn't be unusual to see MOA improve at longer ranges, but not actual group sizes. I've had rifles that would do no better than 1" at 100 yards, but were consistently under 2" at 200. In the 1.5-1.75" range and around 2.5" or better at 300.
This is one of those things debated hotly on the internet. I don't know the exact reason, there are lots of theories. But I've observed it as have too many others to discount it as myth.
The bullets the OP is shooting have BC's about the same as 165/168 gr 308 bullets. Fired from a 223 they drop LESS than a 308 firing 165/168 gr bullets. The lighter 40-50 gr bullets drop considerably less out to at least 500 yards. This isn't a factor even with lightweight bullets until extreme ranges.
And even if they did drop more that is completely irrelevant for target shooting and only a minor inconvenience for hunters. At known ranges bullet drop is easily accounted for.
as Jmr says, if your scope doesnt have enough power to hold that exact aimpoint no matter what the yardage your groups will suffer. I just mounted a 24 fixed power on a new heavy barreled 223 Ruger and it shoots 3 in the same hole at 100 yds. Part gun, part scope, and part shooter...Wish there was a 200 and 300 yd range at my club but no luck there.
NHSHOOTER the question was for jmr40 and his answer could be different then yours .
The original post stated at 100 yards around 1 inch . Then 200 and 300 yard was also ask about . It would be imposable to really give an answer not knowing more data things like scope rest bullet FPS and shooter and more .
Any center Fire rifle can be a long range shooter but just what is long range for the shooter and how much time and money he would like to spend .
Having shot 223 for a lot of years it is more then possible to shoot well at 300 yards (OP,s question) But I think you know a lot of things need to change from 100 yards to shooting 300 yards and more .
A 77 gr. bullet will drop 14.8 inches more at 200 yards and 71.8 inches more on out to 500 yards . I think you know it is very hard to do without the right equipment and good shooting skills (let alone long range)
The original post stated at 100 yards around 1 inch . Then 200 and 300 yard was also ask about . It would be imposable to really give an answer not knowing more data things like scope rest bullet FPS and shooter and more .
Any center Fire rifle can be a long range shooter but just what is long range for the shooter and how much time and money he would like to spend .
Having shot 223 for a lot of years it is more then possible to shoot well at 300 yards (OP,s question) But I think you know a lot of things need to change from 100 yards to shooting 300 yards and more .
A 77 gr. bullet will drop 14.8 inches more at 200 yards and 71.8 inches more on out to 500 yards . I think you know it is very hard to do without the right equipment and good shooting skills (let alone long range)
If the load shoots well at 100yds it will keep shooting well at greater distances . One thing to keep in mind is the bullet decelerates much faster percentage wise then the spin decelerates . So if it's stable at 100yds it should be stable throughout it's flight path until it encounters a destabilizing force .
That said generally speaking 1/2moa at 100yds will shoot about the same at 200yds . How ever every 100yds after that the groups will open up a bit . If the rifle , ammo and shooter are up to it . The difference is not incrementally large but the groups do start to open up on average . Why ? JUST CUASE
308cal , 175gr SMK @ 2650fps drops 4" 200yds , 14.5" at 300yds , 32.8" at 400yds , 59.9" at 500yds and 395" at 1k . This load stays super sonic throughout it's flight path .
223cal , 77gr SMK @ 2700fps drops 4" at 200yds , 15.1" at 300yds , 34.9" @ 400yds , 65.4" at 500yds and 495" at 1k . This load passes the transonic barrier ( destabilizing force ) around 800yds
The 223 goes south after 600yds really as far as drop goes but as you can see out to 500yds it's virtually the same as a 308 in there most commonly used long range bullet weights respectively .
That said generally speaking 1/2moa at 100yds will shoot about the same at 200yds . How ever every 100yds after that the groups will open up a bit . If the rifle , ammo and shooter are up to it . The difference is not incrementally large but the groups do start to open up on average . Why ? JUST CUASE
308cal , 175gr SMK @ 2650fps drops 4" 200yds , 14.5" at 300yds , 32.8" at 400yds , 59.9" at 500yds and 395" at 1k . This load stays super sonic throughout it's flight path .
223cal , 77gr SMK @ 2700fps drops 4" at 200yds , 15.1" at 300yds , 34.9" @ 400yds , 65.4" at 500yds and 495" at 1k . This load passes the transonic barrier ( destabilizing force ) around 800yds
The 223 goes south after 600yds really as far as drop goes but as you can see out to 500yds it's virtually the same as a 308 in there most commonly used long range bullet weights respectively .
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