This weekend I got my Remington 700 .270 back after having a Timney trigger installed (I really like the new trigger) and a bedding job. This was done by a very reputable gunsmith. I took it out and shot two different groups with reloads that have shot sub moa for me out of that rifle before. Today the groups were 2 inch plus. Should I expect to have to "start over" in finding my pet loads after a bedding job? Any other factors that you folks might see as an issue??
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accuracy decrease after trigger and bedding job, help needed!
- Thread starter ReloadKy
- Start date
NoSecondBest
New member
Very wise words. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Bedding can really alter the harmonics of your barrel. Forrest Gump: "you never know what you're gonna get".but if it was already shooting under MOA I wouldn't have had it bedded
stagpanther
New member
Maybe he took someone else's worn out barrel and replaced your's?
Just kidding. You must have had a good reason to change those things (I assume) so just start your search for the grail loads over again.
Just kidding. You must have had a good reason to change those things (I assume) so just start your search for the grail loads over again.
It's likely the bedding job has changed things. Check action screws, scope screws etc. You may have to start over with your loads. Did he float the bbl? May need to put a pressure pad in it. Most factory guns will shoot under 2" with factory loads these days. Just for giggles try some factory loads in it and see what it does.
kilotanker22
New member
Most Remington 700 rifles are pressure pointed right toward the end of the stock. When the smith bedded the action he likely also floated the barrel. Floating that barrel definitely changed the harmonics and I would not be surprised if an otherwise good load does not shoot the same any more.
I would suggest making sure everything is torqued properly, the barrel floated and then start load work up again.
I would suggest making sure everything is torqued properly, the barrel floated and then start load work up again.
Again... how much of the barrel was bedded ?likely also floated the barrel
kilotanker22
New member
Very true, Ideally none of the barrel would be bedded. I would also be curious as to the answer to this question.Again... how much of the barrel was bedded ?
Before you do anything, If I paid a "very reputable gunsmith" to bed my rifle and the group size went from sub MOA to over two inches...
I think I'd go back to the man and have a calm,respectful non-critical conversation with him. Give him a chance to work his magic.
We,including myself,can't really analyze the job from the incomplete information we have. Of the advice we might give you,its shooting in the dark with guesses. Maybe 80% of the advice,including mine,will be wrong.
The screw tensions are important.Of the three screws,only the forward and rear screw are torqued to hold the receiver. The third one is just to hold the trigger guard in place.
One little detail that can mess up accuracy is if bedding compound got in around the screws. The sides of the body of the screw should not contact stock or bedding compound.
A round Remington receiver may have been pillar bedded,on posts.There is not a flat bottom to th receiver. Your smith's plan MAY have been for the receiver to primarily rest on the pillars with full bearing behind the recoil lug.
Maybe with the screws torqued,the mag box is straning the receiver. Your smith knows his plan and will have things to check.
He won't be happy if you muck it up.
Everybody has an opinion. The formula that works for me is dependent on the barrel shoulder seating perfectly to a square,flat receiver face.The Remington uses a washer sort of a recoil lug. I'dprobably start with a surface ground recoil lg and face the receiver before I worried about bedding.
Why? If the barrel and receiver aren't fitted well enough to act as one piece,they can rattle around.I f your scope is mounted to the receiver and the barrel rattles around,accuracy will suffer.
Stock pressure points can hold a rattling barrel to one side. Its a patch It can work to make a rifle shoot pretty well. How does that work out with a tight sling?
IMO,the most reliable method starts with proper barrel fitting. Then bed the receiner so its not being bent when the guard screws are tight.
Then IMO,the stock should not touch the barrel.
Consider how easy it is to build a sub=MOA rife on an AR -10 or AR-15 with a free float forend. It just works. It works in bolt guns s well
I think I'd go back to the man and have a calm,respectful non-critical conversation with him. Give him a chance to work his magic.
We,including myself,can't really analyze the job from the incomplete information we have. Of the advice we might give you,its shooting in the dark with guesses. Maybe 80% of the advice,including mine,will be wrong.
The screw tensions are important.Of the three screws,only the forward and rear screw are torqued to hold the receiver. The third one is just to hold the trigger guard in place.
One little detail that can mess up accuracy is if bedding compound got in around the screws. The sides of the body of the screw should not contact stock or bedding compound.
A round Remington receiver may have been pillar bedded,on posts.There is not a flat bottom to th receiver. Your smith's plan MAY have been for the receiver to primarily rest on the pillars with full bearing behind the recoil lug.
Maybe with the screws torqued,the mag box is straning the receiver. Your smith knows his plan and will have things to check.
He won't be happy if you muck it up.
Everybody has an opinion. The formula that works for me is dependent on the barrel shoulder seating perfectly to a square,flat receiver face.The Remington uses a washer sort of a recoil lug. I'dprobably start with a surface ground recoil lg and face the receiver before I worried about bedding.
Why? If the barrel and receiver aren't fitted well enough to act as one piece,they can rattle around.I f your scope is mounted to the receiver and the barrel rattles around,accuracy will suffer.
Stock pressure points can hold a rattling barrel to one side. Its a patch It can work to make a rifle shoot pretty well. How does that work out with a tight sling?
IMO,the most reliable method starts with proper barrel fitting. Then bed the receiner so its not being bent when the guard screws are tight.
Then IMO,the stock should not touch the barrel.
Consider how easy it is to build a sub=MOA rife on an AR -10 or AR-15 with a free float forend. It just works. It works in bolt guns s well
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Remington 700s are very sensitive to action screw torque. Take the action out of the stock and check to make sure it has clearance around the screws and front of the recoil lug, torque to 55 in-lbs and shoot it. If it's not shooting well, tighten them a little more. When you find the sweet spot for torque, it will be obvious.I did check all three screws with my FAT wrench. The fore end screw was plenty tight. However, the two screws in the trigger guard were not as tight as they should have been.
Your results do not surprise me. Odds are good you don't have eactly the same barrel contact in the inletted channel.
You will get advice here in several different directions.Some of them will make improvement.
If this is a smith you have faith in, talk it over with him.If it was a sub MOA rfle before,it can be again. A good smith will know what to do. Its no secret how to make a Rem 700 shoot.
If I hadt o do it, there are three paths.One is to scrape the high spots out of the barrel channel and maybe re-establish the pressure point. Scraping will remove the wood seal,and you still have to deal with the wood being less than dead stable.
The other is to open up the barrel channel and glass bed the barrel channel.
ts sealed,stabilized,fts like a glove.It might even shoot,
This may involve re-establishing a pressure point.
The third option is opening up the barrel channel quite a bit,maybe .080 in. a side Then you carefully put about 3 layers of thick vinyl tape on the barrel,and glass the barrel channel around that. The result is a full free float.with a sealed,stabilized barrel channel.
Tis "opening up" is not just hack and butcher with a Dremel. It gets done with careto establish a uniform space for the epoxy
and free float.
My preference rns toward full free float
You can just coat the barrel,with Prussian blue (DykemHi-Spot) and assemble it. The blue will transfer and show you the hgh spots.
I like to use Starret feeler guage stock to make a scraper. Maybe .025 thick.
Grind a gentle arc across the width of the feeler. You will create a burr. That's your cutting edge.You drag it on the high spot. It shaves off a couple thousandths. Knock off the hi spots,blue and try till there are no high spots
You will get advice here in several different directions.Some of them will make improvement.
If this is a smith you have faith in, talk it over with him.If it was a sub MOA rfle before,it can be again. A good smith will know what to do. Its no secret how to make a Rem 700 shoot.
If I hadt o do it, there are three paths.One is to scrape the high spots out of the barrel channel and maybe re-establish the pressure point. Scraping will remove the wood seal,and you still have to deal with the wood being less than dead stable.
The other is to open up the barrel channel and glass bed the barrel channel.
ts sealed,stabilized,fts like a glove.It might even shoot,
This may involve re-establishing a pressure point.
The third option is opening up the barrel channel quite a bit,maybe .080 in. a side Then you carefully put about 3 layers of thick vinyl tape on the barrel,and glass the barrel channel around that. The result is a full free float.with a sealed,stabilized barrel channel.
Tis "opening up" is not just hack and butcher with a Dremel. It gets done with careto establish a uniform space for the epoxy
and free float.
My preference rns toward full free float
You can just coat the barrel,with Prussian blue (DykemHi-Spot) and assemble it. The blue will transfer and show you the hgh spots.
I like to use Starret feeler guage stock to make a scraper. Maybe .025 thick.
Grind a gentle arc across the width of the feeler. You will create a burr. That's your cutting edge.You drag it on the high spot. It shaves off a couple thousandths. Knock off the hi spots,blue and try till there are no high spots
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FrankenMauser
New member
Clean it.
Try again.
If that doesn't help, call the 'smith.
Try again.
If that doesn't help, call the 'smith.
"...have to "start over" in finding my pet loads after a bedding job?..." Yep. It's basically a different rifle.
If it didn't have a floated barrel, which guarantees nothing, before and it was floated, it clearly doesn't like a floated barrel. Put a pressure point in. A dab of bedding material about an inch or so aft of the end of the fore stock is all you need to do. That does not mean it'll shoot the same loads that shot sub moa, sub moa though.
If it didn't have a floated barrel, which guarantees nothing, before and it was floated, it clearly doesn't like a floated barrel. Put a pressure point in. A dab of bedding material about an inch or so aft of the end of the fore stock is all you need to do. That does not mean it'll shoot the same loads that shot sub moa, sub moa though.
Don Fischer
New member
Float the barrel to the action and remove that worthless hump. Once that is done tighten the actions screws. Don't tighten the screw in front of the trigger guard, not even after bedding. It should be little more than snug. With the screw's well tightened go to the front screw and very slowly loosen it while watching either the action screw in front of it or the barrel at the front of the stock. You see any movement at all and you need to re-bed. No huge error was not relieving the barrel channel to bed the action. Problem being not letting the barrel float will put stress on the action. When you are ready to bed the action, wrap enough tape around the front of the barrel to keep it from going into the stock. That will hold up the front of that action and not allow stress in the action between the screw's. Once the action is done, remove the barreled action and remove the tape from the barrel. re-install it and use a dollar bill to slide under the barrel. It should go to the action without slowing down anywhere. If it does sand out the area's it does. I use course grit paper for that sanding. I then also like to get the channel opened up to where I can slide a min double sheet of typing paper under the barrel full length.
A lot of people bed the chamber area in the stock. I have done the same thing and the mistake your gonna make the first time is not having the bedding blocked at the front of the chamber to keep it straight across. If it's not straight across, you build in a spot that is going to destroy your accuracy. The bedding at that point must be straight across, or simply float the barrel all the way to the action. When done take it apart one more time checking as you go. Get the barrel action out of the stock and use good gun stock finish to re-finish the inside of the barrel channel. Don't do that and it will soak up water and your work will be for nothing.
Bedding is pretty simple to do but mess it up and the rifle will stay messed up. Had a friend had a 22-250 years ago in a laminated stock. Some guy talked him into letting him bed a push rod from a car engine into the bottom of the barrel to stiffen the barrel channel. Well stiffening the barrel channel on a laminated stock is lost on me. And his rifle didn't shoot any better or any worse after the push rod! The push rod idea came from trying to stiffen up the poor factory plastic stock's. I've never done it myself of don't know that it works.
I have a stock I took off a new 700 ADL years ago. Rifle was terrible shooting. I tried to take it apart to check bedding and couldn't get it out of the stock. To remove it I finally slammed the barrel on the back of the couch till it came loose, took a good number of hit's. The recoil lug recess gripped the recoil lug all the way around, that had to be fixed first. I dug it out with a dremel tool and refiller the recess about 3/4 way with bedding material and let it dry. Rifle still wouldn't come apart. The side rails were pinched in the stock and the rear tang in way to tight. Ground them all out so I could get the barrel action in and out easily then before bedding, took that awful lump out of the barrel channel and floated the barrel. tape around the barrel at the end of the stock to keep it from putting tension on the action and bedded the action. Lot of work and that was the absolutely worst bedded factory rifle I'd ever seem. Got dong and it went from shooting pattern's to a 1/2" rifle! Bedding can be everything and factory's don't do all that great a job at it generally. Put your stock in a vice level, tape the end of the barrel and lay the barreled action in the stock. Should go in without a hitch and lift right back out.
I should add about the recoil lug when bedding. I wrap two layer's of paper tape on it every where except the back of the lug, it fit's snug up to the bedding surface with the screws tight. I recently saw where a guy didn't tape them off but pur plenty of release agent all over the lug. Said it wanted the lug to fit snug. I'm sure it did and if all the tension is out of the action area it should work fine. One last thing about the lug. I cut down the wood in front of the lug all the way across to top and down the front. After the bedding set's up the front of the action set firmly on the bedded area behind the lug and the lug when action it tightened down rest's firmly into the front of the recess area. Nothing moves when the barrel action is set back in but it lift's right out and drops right back in, the fit of the action becomes perfect.
A lot of people bed the chamber area in the stock. I have done the same thing and the mistake your gonna make the first time is not having the bedding blocked at the front of the chamber to keep it straight across. If it's not straight across, you build in a spot that is going to destroy your accuracy. The bedding at that point must be straight across, or simply float the barrel all the way to the action. When done take it apart one more time checking as you go. Get the barrel action out of the stock and use good gun stock finish to re-finish the inside of the barrel channel. Don't do that and it will soak up water and your work will be for nothing.
Bedding is pretty simple to do but mess it up and the rifle will stay messed up. Had a friend had a 22-250 years ago in a laminated stock. Some guy talked him into letting him bed a push rod from a car engine into the bottom of the barrel to stiffen the barrel channel. Well stiffening the barrel channel on a laminated stock is lost on me. And his rifle didn't shoot any better or any worse after the push rod! The push rod idea came from trying to stiffen up the poor factory plastic stock's. I've never done it myself of don't know that it works.
I have a stock I took off a new 700 ADL years ago. Rifle was terrible shooting. I tried to take it apart to check bedding and couldn't get it out of the stock. To remove it I finally slammed the barrel on the back of the couch till it came loose, took a good number of hit's. The recoil lug recess gripped the recoil lug all the way around, that had to be fixed first. I dug it out with a dremel tool and refiller the recess about 3/4 way with bedding material and let it dry. Rifle still wouldn't come apart. The side rails were pinched in the stock and the rear tang in way to tight. Ground them all out so I could get the barrel action in and out easily then before bedding, took that awful lump out of the barrel channel and floated the barrel. tape around the barrel at the end of the stock to keep it from putting tension on the action and bedded the action. Lot of work and that was the absolutely worst bedded factory rifle I'd ever seem. Got dong and it went from shooting pattern's to a 1/2" rifle! Bedding can be everything and factory's don't do all that great a job at it generally. Put your stock in a vice level, tape the end of the barrel and lay the barreled action in the stock. Should go in without a hitch and lift right back out.
I should add about the recoil lug when bedding. I wrap two layer's of paper tape on it every where except the back of the lug, it fit's snug up to the bedding surface with the screws tight. I recently saw where a guy didn't tape them off but pur plenty of release agent all over the lug. Said it wanted the lug to fit snug. I'm sure it did and if all the tension is out of the action area it should work fine. One last thing about the lug. I cut down the wood in front of the lug all the way across to top and down the front. After the bedding set's up the front of the action set firmly on the bedded area behind the lug and the lug when action it tightened down rest's firmly into the front of the recess area. Nothing moves when the barrel action is set back in but it lift's right out and drops right back in, the fit of the action becomes perfect.
Mr OHeir:
If you read post # 15,you will discover this rifle had the receiver only bedded.The barrel channel ids Rem inletted with a pressure point. Clearly it is not free floated.
I can appreciate your lack of acceptance for free floating may be about typical curmudgeon xenophobia....and indeed,going back to your days of the SMLE free foating was not the formula. Back then,the skinny,long SMLE barrels resting in full length stocks were not good candidates for free floating.
Ive already mentioned the foundation of a proper barrel to receiver joint
Without that,free floating is futile.The stock is used like a splint or a cast for a broken leg.,and the Armourer/smith used salamander skins and bat wings to shm and damp the SMLE to shoot quite well.
But that says nothing about free floating.
A pressure point is like pushing a wobbly fence post to ne side. Its a patch that sort of works. Better the fence post was solid in the hole.
But cutting match books,playing cads,etc to put in the barrel channel is easier than squaring a receiver ring. Till you sling up.
Every time someone mentiones free floating,you respond with a comment saying it does not work.
So please explain something to me..
I've built,been in on building,and seen the results of others building a lot of AR type rifles. Some were made with Badger or Kreiger cut rifled barrels.
Others have been made with Wilson,White Oak,Crterion,Olymic,etc barrels.If free foating is so mediocre and unreliable,how come folks who are not gunsmiths,but reasonable mechanics,can assemble free floated rifles that more often than not,shoot sub-MOA,,and a few shoot ragged holes at 100 yds?
From the barrel nut forward,nothing but the gas blockand tube influence the barrel.
Admittedly,my chrome lined ,hammer forged Daniel Defense barrel is about 1 1/4 MOA at 100 yds. I'm not disappointed.
We just don't get "stinkers" that won't shoot well under 2 MOA
P[ese tell me how that happens if free floating is so wrong?
If you read post # 15,you will discover this rifle had the receiver only bedded.The barrel channel ids Rem inletted with a pressure point. Clearly it is not free floated.
I can appreciate your lack of acceptance for free floating may be about typical curmudgeon xenophobia....and indeed,going back to your days of the SMLE free foating was not the formula. Back then,the skinny,long SMLE barrels resting in full length stocks were not good candidates for free floating.
Ive already mentioned the foundation of a proper barrel to receiver joint
Without that,free floating is futile.The stock is used like a splint or a cast for a broken leg.,and the Armourer/smith used salamander skins and bat wings to shm and damp the SMLE to shoot quite well.
But that says nothing about free floating.
A pressure point is like pushing a wobbly fence post to ne side. Its a patch that sort of works. Better the fence post was solid in the hole.
But cutting match books,playing cads,etc to put in the barrel channel is easier than squaring a receiver ring. Till you sling up.
Every time someone mentiones free floating,you respond with a comment saying it does not work.
So please explain something to me..
I've built,been in on building,and seen the results of others building a lot of AR type rifles. Some were made with Badger or Kreiger cut rifled barrels.
Others have been made with Wilson,White Oak,Crterion,Olymic,etc barrels.If free foating is so mediocre and unreliable,how come folks who are not gunsmiths,but reasonable mechanics,can assemble free floated rifles that more often than not,shoot sub-MOA,,and a few shoot ragged holes at 100 yds?
From the barrel nut forward,nothing but the gas blockand tube influence the barrel.
Admittedly,my chrome lined ,hammer forged Daniel Defense barrel is about 1 1/4 MOA at 100 yds. I'm not disappointed.
We just don't get "stinkers" that won't shoot well under 2 MOA
P[ese tell me how that happens if free floating is so wrong?
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