A question for IPSC shooters. Help with the rules.

P

Pond James Pond

New member
I hoot IPSC in production division. I shoot a CZ 75 SP-01.

I have been vaguely entertaining the idea of selling my existing race gun in order to get one that would be more practical in other areas of my shooting whilst still being IPSC eligible.

I am not interested in an analysis of my choice of gun, just on the interpretation of the current IPSC rules that could influence if a gun is possible to use.

The guns I am considering are the CZ Rami sub-compact and the CZ 75 Compact. I am considering either the safety model, but would prefer the decocker D model. It is the decocker model this thread concerns.

The IPSC production approved handgun list lists them all as approved for Production division.

In section 8.1.2.5 IPSC rules say:

If a handgun has a decocking lever, that alone must be used to decock the handgun, without touching the trigger. If a handgun does not have a decocking lever, the hammer must be safely and manually lowered all the way forward (i.e. not just to a “half-cock notch” or to another similar intermediary position).
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That would seem to suggest that if you use a decocking lever you are good to go, and only manually decocked models require the hammer to be all the way down.

However the production division appendix section paragraph 15 makes further assertions:

Handguns with external hammers must be fully decocked (see Rule 8.1.2.5), at the Start Signal.
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So now it seems that any gun with a hammer, no matter how it can be lowered safely must have a fully decocked hammer.

Since I started researching the decocker models I listed above, I have found out that these CZs, when decocked using the lever, drop the hammer to half-cock position, thus contravening paragraph 15 listed above, yet rule 8.1.2.5 would prohibit me from performing any decocking by hand if there is a lever designed to do the job.

So how would one "make ready" with a CZ decocker model that only drops the hammer half way?!

Can you help?
Have you competed with these or similar guns?
IPSC only please!
 
It seems to me that "fully decocked" for a gun with mechanical decocking lever is wherever the lever puts the hammer. If it is at half cock after you depress the decocking lever, then that is fully decocked, because you may not touch the trigger.
 
Seems logical.

I've actually written to the IPSC HQ for their take as I really want to have this water tight because I am sure it would come up at some stage (excuse the pun) and don't want to even entertain the idea of buying a gun that might not qualify.

I'll be curious to see what the IPSC guys say, but what you say seems very reasonable indeed. I think I was blinded by the nomenclature "half-cock"position when talking about the CZs.
 
I gave up on IPSC years ago.When they had a staff that told me to "drop your Hammer" when I had my HK P7 !! "It doesn't have one " "well drop it anyway " .
:rolleyes:
And when they permitted weird guns , sights, holsters .Apparently that group didn't know the P in IPSC stood for Practical !:eek:
 
Your interpretation was:

It seems to me that "fully decocked" for a gun with mechanical decocking lever is wherever the lever puts the hammer. If it is at half cock after you depress the decocking lever, then that is fully decocked, because you may not touch the trigger.
Click to expand...

And here is the official response from IPSC:

If the gun has a decocking lever, you must use it, and wherever the hammer rests satisfies the rules.
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So you were right! :)
 
Folks in other parts of the world would be surprised how few genuine IPSC matches are held here in the US.
Our USPSA rules are very different in some areas.
 
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