A Model for the NRA - Barf Alert - Advice from Chuckie

Oatka

New member
This from the man who would try to repeal the 2nd Amendment. The idiot doesn't menton increased enforcement on DUIs.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A20239-2000May27.html

A Model for the NRA

By Charles E. Schumer
Sunday, May 28, 2000; Page B07

As one of its most persistent foes, I shed no tears for the plight of the gun lobby. But I do have some advice for the NRA and its allies: Use the alcohol industry as a model for the gun industry.

In 1982, the alcohol lobby was facing many of the same pressures that the gun lobby is today. Drunk driving deaths, particularly those related to underage drinking, surpassed 25,000. Beer makers were under public criticism for airing glitzy advertisements aimed at teenagers. A group of fed-up mothers formed Mothers Against Drunk Driving, a nascent grass-roots anti-alcohol campaign that was shortly to become a powerhouse. Congress, which usually supported the alcohol industry, had begun to consider steep increases in excise taxes and advertising restrictions.

Under siege, the industry conducted extensive market research and discovered that only a tiny slice of its business derived from kids and drunks. Well over 95 percent of its revenue came from responsible drinkers. Most bars and liquor stores tried to keep teens from buying alcohol, but a few bad apples--stores and bars that would serve anyone no matter their age or sobriety--were defining the industry.

So beer makers reversed course and embarked on a massive campaign to reduce drunk driving and stop sales to teenagers. Ads featuring beer-guzzling dogs were replaced with "don't drink and drive," "know when to say when" and the "designated driver" campaign. By working with law enforcement and lawmakers and by creating a campaign to ID anyone who looked younger than 26 years of age, the industry clamped down on bars and stores that served minors.

Within 15 years, drunk driving deaths decreased by 10,000, with the most pronounced success among youth fatalities. Best of all for the industry, its bottom line is healthy, with no imminent threat of new laws or serious litigation.

The parallels to the gun industry are striking. Most gun owners are responsible, but a criminal element wreaks havoc on society. Though most guns are designed for hunting, sport or protection, certain guns are designed for criminal use and certain models show up habitually at crime scenes. Most gun stores try to keep weapons out of the hands of criminals, but one percent of the nation's 104,000 gun stores are the source of more than half the guns traced to crime.

The typical gun purchase is totally legitimate, but some are easily recognizable by any store clerk as a straw purchase destined for the black market.

Thus far the gun industry, with the exception of Smith and Wesson, has taken no interest in who sells its guns, who buys them, who resells them or who kills with them. Now it is paying the price through litigation in the courts and in the court of public opinion, where the industry looks extreme and uncaring.

The gun industry needs to follow the model of the alcohol industry and jettison the bad actors for the sake of the majority who are responsible. It should end its opposition to the hiring of new Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms federal agents who will crack down on high-crime gun stores. The industry should support closing the gun show loophole, which clearly allows criminals to avoid the Brady background check, and should favor efforts to require all gun sales to go through a Brady check. It should back law enforcement efforts to create a DNA ballistics database so that a bullet found at a crime scene will identify the gun from which it was fired. Gun manufacturers ought to make trigger locks a standard, non-optional part of a gun.

These and other modest, nonintrusive measures would go a long way toward reducing crime and convincing the public that the gun lobby is as concerned about the bad actors as it is about gun owners' rights.

The NRA has a choice. It can follow the model of the alcohol industry and become part of the solution, or it can follow the model of another industry that faced similar circumstances but chose to stand and fight: the tobacco industry. Tobacco companies just paid a $300 billion fine and are still under the cloud of litigation and legislation.

Charlton Heston may bring the house down with his annual "never surrender" speech to the faithful, but it would be smarter for the NRA to know when to say when.

The writer, a Democratic senator from New York, wrote the Brady law and the assault weapons ban.

© 2000 The Washington Post Company

-- 30 --

My letter to the Post, sure to be printed ;)

Letterstoed@washpost.com

To the Editor:

The Post should emulate the Internet message boards and post a "Barf Alert" when printing articles by Sen. Schumer.

He should stick to what he knows best - trying to ban ALL guns and expanding government power.

In 1982 the alcohol industry was not facing government-backed litigation. Mothers Against Drunk Drivers advocated stiffer sentences for criminal use of alcohol -"enforce existing laws in today's vernacular.

Sen. Schumer states, ". . . certain guns are designed for criminal use . . . ". I scan many gun tabloids, newspaper classifieds, and the Internet. I have yet to see a category called "Criminal Use".

In his best polemical style, "Thus far the gun industry, with the exception of Smith and Wesson, has taken no interest in who sells its guns, who buys them, who resells them or who kills with them." This thinking implies that Ford, GM, and Chrylser should be blamed for selling cars to people without regard to whom they may be resold.

Another gem, "The typical gun purchase is totally legitimate, but some are easily recognizable by any store clerk as a straw purchase destined for the black market." Are clerks now required to possess ESP? Or he is thinking of racial profiling?

Sen. Schumer should restrict his advice to Handgun Control, Inc., or better yet, know what he is talking about.

Yours truly, etc.


------------------
The New World Order has a Third Reich odor.

[This message has been edited by Oatka (edited May 28, 2000).]
 
If we are not careful, this "time to crime" issue is going to bite us in the butt. It is going to be the next "gun show loophole". We're going to wake up one morning and find that our favorite gun store has been shut down by the ATF for being successful. The way "time to crime" is counted is a total and complete LIE.

Robert
 
Oatka:

Re your response to Shumer comment in Washington Post, well said, though not likely to see the light of day in that particular paper.
 
I regard Schumer as pond scum, so it pains me to agree with him in even the tiniest way.

I will concur with him when it comes to public perception. His anti-self defense proposals are bogus. However, the industry would be wise to pool resources and encourage safe shooting, shooting sports, PSA's about firearms safety, etc. I know they do some of this, but it is minimal.

Whether they have the available advertising budgets is another story. And, I hear reports that various media refuse such attempts.

Regards from AZ
 
Well, it can't hurt for some of us to try to get through. My letter to the Post's editors:

To the editors:

No doubt the NRA is grateful for the advice given by Senator Schumer
in his op-ed column, "A model for the NRA." Unfortunately, it seems
Mr. Schumer cannot hear the NRA due to a din of his own creation.

For years the NRA has asked that efforts to reduce gun violence be
aimed at those who criminally misuse guns, rather than at the law
abiding. This is precisely the same tack that was taken very successfully
by Mothers Against Drunk Driving, the group that Senator Schumer
suggests the NRA emulate.

MADD, however, never advocated mandatory locks on liquor cabinets,
background checks and three day waiting periods to buy a drink at a
public event, licensing and photographing and fingerprinting those who
wanted to buy a beer, bans on bottles under or over a certain size,
national registration of all alcoholic beverage containers, a
"one-wine-a-month" limit, bans on arbitrarily-designated imported
alcoholic beverages, or bans on alcoholic beverages based entirely on
their appearance. All of these are the alcohol equivalent to gun
legislation that Mr. Schumer has either authored or endorsed.

If Senator Schumer is sincere in his advice to the NRA--a supposition
which requires a Herculean leap of faith--he should first ask this
Administration why prosecutions of federal gun law violations fell 46%
from 1992 to 1998. Were there a drop of that magnitude in drunk
driving arrests, MADD would indeed be mad.
 
Question: Why is he even writing this letter? What was his intent in doing so?
Does he really give a tinkers darn for you, or I, or our 2nd Amendment?

Is he trying to get a slight concession from US, not the NRA? After all, the NRA membership did what in the past few months? You say, it increased? How can that be, if there is such popular opinion toward gun control?

And for that matter, why has the bulbous nosed one been so cool about the gun issue since challenged by LaPierre? What have they seen that disturbs them so?
Are they indeed afraid of the sector that is armed?
Are they afraid we will succeed in getting the 2nd under review of the Supreme Court before the can totally destroy the BOR.

I understand there was a panel committe assigned with researching the truth of the 2nd Amendment, and it revealed to the Feds that it was exactly what we say it is, but that they shelved the research out of fear.

Best Regards,
Don

------------------
The most foolish mistake we could make would be to allow the subjected people to carry arms;
History shows that all conquerers who have allowed their subjected people to carry arms have prepared their own fall.
Adolf Hitler
-----------------
"Corrupt the young, get them away from religion. Get them interested in sex. Make them superficial, and destroy their rugged- ness.
Get control of all means of publicity, and thereby get the peoples' mind off their government by focusing their attention on athletics, sexy books and plays, and other trivialities.
Divide the people into hostile groups by constantly harping on controversial matters of no importance."

Vladimir Ilich Lenin, former leader of USSR

[This message has been edited by Donny (edited May 28, 2000).]
 
I would consider the man sewer scum, not wholsome pond scum.
His agenda is not working out according to plan, thanks to to his cynical misreading of the character of the American people.
He is now taking a cue from his master, Bill Clinton, and trying to hide behind Motherhood!
I don't think it will work.
 
Good answer, Oatka.

I prefer your style of point-by-point, contextual rebuttal to a rant response. Good on ya.

*************

". . . certain guns are designed for criminal use . . . " ... Jesus Christ!



[This message has been edited by sensop (edited May 29, 2000).]
 
"...one percent of the nation's 104,000 gun stores are the source of more than half the guns traced to crime."

Someone please tell me if my logic is flawed. If the gummint knows that one percent of the dealers are the source of this problem, wouldn't it therefore know WHICH one percent it is? Then they could just shut down that small group of dealers, and most of the supply of 'crime guns' would dry up.

I guess this bogus 'big lie' crap plays pretty well with the soccer moms.
 
Every time I see this guy, he looks over the edge to me. No wonder I always think of Chuckie, the homicidal puppet character from the movies. He is a wiiner take all kind of guy with no regard to views that do not match his own. That is why he is so dangerous to the Second Amendment.
 
The biggest problem with Chuckie's commentary is what is not written, but what you can read between the lines. He seems to concede that most gun purchases are made by law-abiding citizens for legitimate reasons. But then he says:

"Though most guns are designed for hunting, sport or protection, certain guns are designed for criminal use and certain models show up habitually at crime scenes".

Therein lies the catch, the trigger phrase that will allow the govt. to expand an increasing list of "banned weapons". Let's face it, we can never agree with folks like Chuckie, never come to the table to have a discussion because the very guns they want to ban ("assault" rifles, handguns) are the very ones the 2nd Amendment specifically was designed to protect.

BTW, if Schumer ever read "Unintended Consequences", he would know that the risk he faces from continuing to infringe upon our Constitutional rights is much, much greater than anything the gun lobby ever could.
 
Oatka, Monkeyleg, very good letters. And thanks for the post (not the newspaper).

I just can never see that the gunmakers have ever directly marketed their wares to young folks. Am I missing something here?
Schummer says that booze companies don't do this, but look who they use to sell it: pro athletes and babes. Who do kids idolize? Pro athletes and babes. DUH!

Furthermore, schummer(forget the caps on this idiot's name, he's not worth it) seems to have NEVER read the barrel of a gun, much less the instruction manual. Has anyone on TFL bought a new gun recently that did not have something like 'READ INSTRUCTIONS' stamped on the barrel? Has scummer thought about counting the number of times that SAFETY is mentioned in the pages of said manual?

He's an idiot, pure and simple. I hope his hooha falls off and drops next to the klintonses - both of them - and reno's.
 
Let's also remember to thank MADD for the unconstitutional "drunk stops" accross the country.

Perhaps we'll soon join NYC with the "Show me your ID, and get up against the wall so I can frisk you" stops.
 
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