A hull is a hull is a hull . . . NOT!

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Prof Young

New member
Loaders:
I'm starting my adventure in to shotgun ammo reloading. This is mainly because I now have two range toys (Taurus Public Defender and Bond Arms Rowdy) that shoot 410 ammo which is fun but kind of expensive.

I looked around for a used Mec or other reloader that would handle 410 and have not been successful in finding one at a good price yet. In the mean time I've purchased the wack-a-mole version from XRing and will start with it. Actually, that may be all I really need as I don't expect to shoot in large volumes.

I also have the Lyman Shotshell Reloading Handbook, 5th edition. I'm starting my way through it today.

Finally, my question . . .I'm getting the impression that the make of hull makes more difference in shotshell reloading than the make of the brass does in rifle or pistol reloading. In other words a 2.5 inch high brass 410 hull from brand X may be different enough from one made by brand Y that I'd need to use different reloading data. Right? Wrong? Talk to me please.

I'm happy to hear any advice about reloading 410. Although I am working my way through the Lyman book there is nothing to replace the voice of one who has direct experience.

Life is good.
Prof Young
 
.410

The components involved in shot shell reloading are most important as are the wads, primers, etc. After you finish reading the reloading book you have you will see the vast differences between components and their performance.
 
Re: shotgun ammo, I believe 12 gauge will always be found cheaper, round for round. This is due to economies of scale; they make tons of it. In the other gauges, it costs more because they make less. 12 gauge is also more effective in all applications, except 10 gauge which is not nearly as popular.
What I am saying is: When you buy a shotgun, you want 12 gauge, for any purposes.
 
As ammo.crafter said, hulls are the first thing you select when reloading shotshells. Do not deviate from the various loading manual recipes...pressures are dependent on hull brand/type, wad, and primer.

In 12 ga & 20 ga, Rem STS hulls are generally considered among the best. In 28 ga, WW AA-HS are the best hulls. However, I haven't kept up with which .410 hulls are considered top shelf for reloading.

Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
 
I'm getting the impression that the make of hull makes more difference in shotshell reloading than the make of the brass does in rifle or pistol reloading.
Click to expand...

Yep, totally different ballgame. Not only the hull, but the wad as well. Not a lot of latitude when it comes to loading shotshells.

Don
 
From my short experience many years ago, if you are going to reload shotgun ammo pick a manufacturer's brand you like and use that brand exclusively. The problem was not the powder or shot but the wads and crimp types. Once you have determined the wads needed for that brand, only then can you set up the reloading equipment for that brand. I finally gave up shot shells back in the 1970's.
 
I'm getting the impression that the make of hull makes more difference in shotshell reloading than the make of the brass does in rifle or pistol reloading. In other words a 2.5 inch high brass 410 hull from brand X may be different enough from one made by brand Y that I'd need to use different reloading data. Right? Wrong? Talk to me please.
Click to expand...

Yes, that's correct. Although brass from different manufacturers may vary somewhat, the internal volume is more or less consistent. Reloading manuals will tell you what brand they used to develop a particular load, but they don't necessarily recommend that you use that exact brand, only that you start low and work up carefully.

Reloading shotgun shells is different. The internal volume of shotgun hulls can vary a lot between brands or between types of hull in the same brand (e.g., "low base" vs. "high base") and shotgun load recipes should be followed near exactly. I've loaded for 4 different gauges for a few decades and I've never not followed a recipe exactly as written. I get the sense (no real data, just a sense, and I wouldn't chance it) that a particular load that's safe in one brand of hull will likely be safe in another. What will change, however, is the length of the "column" (powder, wad, shot) inside the shell, and that will affect the ability of the press to crimp the shell properly.

I use W296 in my .410 loads, and have for probably 40 years. I load for skeet, so only use 1/2 oz. #9 shot and frankly I don't recall the powder weight - I set my press up with the correct bushing - based on the Lyman shotshell manual and the MEC list of bushings (confirmed with a scale, of course) - all those years ago and, as long as I don't change anything, which I don't, there's no need to think about it.
 
Yes, different shotgun hulls make more of a difference than different brands of rifle and pistol cases.

Shotgun shell data is a precise thing, and the only substitution you can do is change the shot SIZE (not the weight). Changing anything else means you no longer have reliable data.

Shotgun strength is less than rifles and (most) pistols. A change in components that results in a change in pressure that a rifle or pistol might ignore might be dangerous in a shotgun, which is why it is important to use ONLY the components listed in shotgun data.

Shooting .410 out of a pistol gives you, perhaps, more of a safety "cushion" for pressure than a shotgun, but there's no way to really know that until something blows out/up, and that's something we strive to avoid.

Simply put, use only those components specified in shotgun data, or don't use the data at all.
 
Thanks for all the responses.

Loaders:
Thanks for the helpful responses. After Chapter three of the Lyman book I pretty well get the picture. Follow the published formula exactly.

Looks to me like the only latitude is the kind of shot. Weight of shot is what counts, not so much size.

Would that be correct?

Life is good.
Prof Young
 
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Looks to me like the only latitude is the kind of shot. Weight of shot is what counts, not so much size.
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The type of shot matters as much as the wad. Steel, bismuth and lead all have different needs and different wads. Weight of the shot is important, size of the shot is not. In my experience 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot fills the wad the same as 1 1/8 oz #4 buck and 00 buck.

Shot shells are constructed in 2 ways that make them have different volume. One type is made with straight wall tube with a wad compressed into the base to lock it in. Federal, Cheddite and Fiocci are made this way. The second is a tapered case wall with molded base. Remington premier and Win AA are made this way. Cut an empty hull down the length of the shell, you will see the difference.
 
There is a slight difference in hulls so says a Lyman shotshell 3rd addition. I shooting a 410 at partridge and bunny's. I found it easier to purchase components that are readily available year round. One business place I found helpful for that purpose. Ballistic Products in Corcoran, MN. Those friendly guys are very knowledgeable and will field questions over the phone or a text. Check em out you'll see.
 
Hulls are different as seashells on the beach. Different hulls are molded, either one-piece or composite, with plastic or fiber base wads of different sizes based on powder charge, shot charge, intended application, etc. This is why a good shotshell loading manual is an absolute necessity. You source wads based on the hulls and shot charge you are going to use, it's not a one-size fits all or a grab bag where you can use whatever you got.
 
big al hunter wrote:
..... The second is a tapered case wall with molded base. Remington premier and Win AA are made this way.
Click to expand...

Yep, That's why I chose to reload the Win AA cases for my 12 gauge
and the Rem Premier cases for my 28 gauge.

I did the reloading research and then bought a 10 box case of both.
Both manuf use these better cases for their skeet loads and they are about as inexpensive as I could get.

Shot'em up and reloaded the empties about 8 times each
before the cracks started at the crimps.
That's 9 x 250 = 2,250 shots for each gauge !!!
 
For 410, you want to use Winchester AAHS; same for 28 gauge. For 12 and 20, you want to use Remington (any one of them)
Remington in 12 and 20 are the more uniform in size; in 28 and 410, Winchesters are.
Through August 1, Winchester has a $2/box rebate, good for 50 boxes (10 flats)
A MEC Jr. can be found used for a decent price. Claybuster wads are a better choice than OEMs from Winchester or Remington, Win 209 are a great decent primer ( Ibuy them 10K at a time) IF you can get the red PC powder baffle, do so as it really helps meter powder very well. Understand that the bushing typically drop light so use your scale.
 
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