A good argument for voting Libertarian

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Jack 99

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I know TFLers go down this road at least once a week, but this was kind of a fresh perspective from www.boortz.com I thought some of you may be interested in.

I'm not saying a word. Just presenting it here for your discriminating review:

"THANK YOU KINDLY, DESERT PETE

You've got to prime the pump
You must have faith and believe …… ("Desert Pete," The Kingston Trio)

It’s a song about a desert traveler who happens upon an old pump standing in the middle of nowhere. Hanging on the
pump is a bucket … with some water in it. The traveler has two choices. He can take the guaranteed safe route and
drink the water, or he can use that water to prime the pump to bring up even more water from below. If the traveler
takes the guaranteed, safe route and just drinks the water in the bucket it will leave the bucket empty for the next
traveler, and no way to prime the pump. At least he won’t be taking a chance that there’s no more water in the pump.
End of story.

Well, that’s the way I look at my presidential vote in this year’s election. That’s my vote in that bucket. Do I cast that
vote for the Republican nominee --- the safe choice --- or do I use it to try to prime the pump.

I absolutely believe that it is going to be a resurgence of libertarian thought --- a love for freedom, liberty and individual
responsibility --- that is going to save America from the tyranny of statism and government dependence. I think there
are millions of American voters who are looking for a political home. Millions of American voters who, while they
appreciate the personal and social liberties promoted by the left, just can’t handle the statist, socialistic big government
tyranny that is developing from the Democratic Party political agenda. These millions of voters also appreciate the
smaller-government fiscal conservatism of the Republicans, but can’t handle the influences of the religious zealots
who want to control and dictate every aspect of a person’s personal life.

I truly believe if that pump standing out there in the political desert is primed with my vote, and with the votes of others
who fear for the future of our country, it might just start pouring forth the votes and support of these lost and dismayed
American voters.

Sure – I can take the safe route and vote for Bush. Actually, that would be more a vote against Gore …. But the safe
route nonetheless. But if I chose that course of action I leave that pump un-primed and un-workable. If enough people
follow the safe route – and vote Republican – that pump not only remains unused … but there will be no water left in
the bucket to prime it with.

The libertarian voters are out there … I’m convinced of it. Freedom loving Americans are just sitting there beneath the
surface, waiting for someone to come along and furiously work the pump-handle.

There’s really not that much time left, friends. Actually, we’re already on borrowed time. We’ve already exceeded the
average life span of governments based on personal liberty by about 25 years. It’s way past time to play it safe. We
need to prime the pump and see what’s down there."


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"Put a rifle in the hands of a Subject, and he immediately becomes a Citizen." -- Jeff Cooper

"The fact is that the average man's love of liberty is nine-tenths imaginary, exactly like his love of sense, justice and truth. He is not actually happy when free; he is uncomfortable, a bit alarmed, and intolerably lonely. Liberty is not a thing for the great masses of men. It is the exclusive possession of a small and disreputable minority, like knowledge, courage and honor. It takes a special sort of man to understand and enjoy liberty - and he is usually an outlaw in democratic societies." -- H.L. Mencken, February 12, 1923, Baltimore Evening Sun

"If God had not wanted them to be sheared, he would not have made them sheep." -- Bad guy from the Magnificent Seven.

"Don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blow." -- Bob Dylan

"This is This" -- Robert DeNiro as "Michael" in THE DEER HUNTER

"The unarmed man is not just defenseless - he is also contemptible." -- Machiavelli
 
Sure. Prime the pump. Lose three Supreme Court nominations. Lose dozens of Federal Court nominations (both those currently vacant and the ones to become vacant during the next 4-8 years). Lose the ability to determine what bureaucrats are in position to make official policy. Lose the ability to do anything with your "pump" once it's primed.

I'm a native of Tennesse, an attorney and an employee of a federal agency that Gore has taken a personal trust in. Trust me. You do not want that psychopath in office. I don't care what you think or feel, but letting this nut job in will
 
I'd prefer to fire everyone in DC and start over. I also think having the 'third party' as a strong runner...even as a winning candidate would be great. However, I DO NOT see it this year. I think getting the Clinton/Gore loonies out of the house is utmost important. Using the next 4 years to build the Liberitarian party to becoming a actual foe is the better way to go. VOTING the Lib party would give us Gore...then possibly Hitlery in 4 years. Do you want that?

I say lets get rid of the stinky garbage NOW, then after the windows are opened overnight...drag out the rest of the trash.
 
Unfortunately, Satanta, we Libertarians have been hearing this same argument since 1976. Lots of folks keep saying yes, we need to vote for Libertarians, but always at some point in the future. And every election someone always discovers that the president nominates candidates for the Supreme Court, and offers that as an reason why it's just not time yet to vote for anyone except one of the major socialist candidates. Meanwhile we move ever closer to a total police state, and the best the Republicans have to offer is a promise to take us there slower than the Democrats will. What a deal.
 
If the choice is between voting Republican and delaying the police state by a few years, and voting Libertarian, and speeding up the process, I'll vote Republican.
 
Buzz - Nicely put. There will be plenty of time to prime the Libertarian pump after we have driven the wolf from the door for four more years.

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Idiot, n. A member of a large and powerful tribe whose influence in human affairs has always been dominant and controlling. -- Ambrose Bierce
 
NOW I gotta chime in.

1) There will always be a Wolf at the door.

2) Insanity is defined as repeating the same behavior over and over with the expectation of a different result.

Im not a "pure libertarian" but its growing more and more obvious there is no solution to the deterioration of freedom through the Republican party.

I will vote Libertarian or Constitution party in November.
 
There is no good argument for throwing a vote away on the Libertarian party. They simply don't have the support it will take to win and they are getting weaker all the time thanks to gentlemen like Mr Perot and others.
Sure, it would be nice to see a third party candidate in office, but it is NOT a realistic scenario right now.
Besides, do people really believe the parasites in Congress are going to allow a candidate to take office and abolish the graft, corruption, etc they've spent years perfecting?
 
David...i understand your point and I truly would like to see the third party make it in. However...the third part just doesn't have the numbers. There must be a problem with the way the Liberatarians or Constitutionalists are putting their objectives forward. Or they just aren't getting the media coverage. That's where I have to say "Hmmm....I vote Lib/Con and I get Gore. Or I vote Repub and [hopefully] get Bush." I'd sure as hell vote Lib if I thought there was a snowballs chance in hell for the party elect to make it but I just don't see it. My main concern is getting rid of BC at THIS moment. If the Lib/Con party would be more in the limelight I'd consoder it but it's ranking at what? 10% of voters?

I don't mind 'losing' but I don't want to lose to Gore/Clinton AGAIN. So unless I see numbers that show promise of a GOOD chance...I have to go Repub in this election.
 
Jack said...

"2) Insanity is defined as repeating the same behavior over and over with the expectation of a different result."


I'm sorry Jack, but we are NOT repeating any kind of behavior over this year by voting for Bush. When in this country's history has it's own Commander In Chief led an all out attack on legitimate firearms manufacturers? When have we ever had over thirty states, cities, and even a cabinet department (HUD) trying to sue legitimate gun makers into bankruptcy because they couldn't have their way in Congress? The gun makers are on the verge of bankruptcy and a Republican President and Congress could put a stop to all of this madness caused by the frivolous lawsuits. If gun makers can be sued into bankruptcy, who is going to be next? Bible makers? Automobile makers? No one will be safe.

Gore wants licensing of gun owners and registration of firearms. We all know where that leads... CONFISCATION! When have we had to face this very real posssiblity in the past?

As Jim pointed out, the next president will nominate as many as 4 new Supreme Court justices. Emerson is on the way there, as are some other cases like the one from California, it is an absolute necessity that Al Gore not be picking those judges.

The bottom line is this... The only REAL hope of stopping the antigunners for good without taking up arms in defense of 2nd Amendment rights is a Supreme Court decision that will settle this issue once and for all. We have a very small window of opportunity coming up this November where we can try to stop this thing without bloodshed, and we have to take it. A vote for anybody besides Bush and progun Republicans (and a few Democrats) is a vote to let the shooting begin. Please think long and hard before you decide to take that road!

This is hardly a typical year and your arguments simply don't wash!

Sincerely,
Joe
http://second.amendment.homepage.com
 
My argument washes just fine, thanks.

YOU CAN'T GET THERE FROM HERE!

We have 2 related threads going on this. Here's my last post to the "Is it just me, or is it 1992 all over again?" thread started by buzz_knox:

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I've given this a lot of consideration this year. I used to be a Republican. Now I'm registered as a Libertarian. Constitution Party might be able to swing my vote, though.

You can't get there from here, folks.

You can't expect politicos with a stake in growing the Federal Monstrosity to do the right thing and preserve your freedoms.

Case in point: Free Dope under the guise of expanding Medicare to cover prescription drugs for the elderly. Pure Socialistic income re-distribution scheme. Republicans like Bush, if he had any principle, would oppose it. BUT WAIT! This is the blue-hair, AARP vote and Gore is touting his plan and getting lots of response. The media is keeping the issue out front of the people. So what does Bushie do? Why, come out with his own semi-privatized plan of course. It will still cost us all money. And its still UnConstitutional (like anybody in DC really cares, but it is).

Get the picture? The Republicans HAVE to keep expanding The Beast. To do otherwise would make them, well, just like the Libertarians. Small and appealing only to freedom lovers.

Political realities aside, I'm not "wasting my vote" for the flip-side of Socialism. The Republic is probably lost anyway, I'm going to watch us go to a "mobocracy" with a clear conscience though.

HARRY BROWNE 2000!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Read my thread about the "good reason to vote Libertarian")

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The Repubs have the same vested interest in big gubmint the Dems have. The 2 party system is more myth than reality. I wish I had it at my fingertips, but Claire Wolf wrote up a deal on all the unConstitutional, anti-freedom legislation that's passed through the Repub-led Congress. The issue is bigger than RKBA.

Sorry, the Repubs would have to fundamentally change thier tune to make me vote for them.
 
Ah, the perennial argument. :)

Prime the pump, sure ... but don't simply cast that water away onto the hot sand.

I'm voting Libertarian for every office except that of president. Georgedub ain't so bad. And Gore is unthinkable.

pax

"The men the American people admire most extravagantly are the most daring liars; the men they detest most violently are those who try to tell them the truth." -- attrib. to H. L. Mencken
 
Please give me the specific plans to further the RKBA that you will institute after the election of Gore and how they will be better than such plans with President Bush.

No speeches - specifics. Put up or shut up.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by buzz_knox:
If the choice is between voting Republican and delaying the police state by a few years, and voting Libertarian, and speeding up the process, I'll vote Republican.

[/quote]

And that IS such a nice, short-sighted view, isnt it, Buzz?

Question: What are you going to tell your grand-children when they ask you the whereabouts of your cache of stashed weapons?

After all, by then, at the rate things are going now, it will be prohibited to own any firearms by order of Der Fuhrer....err,
I mean the President of the United States.
 
When are the 3rd party people gonna get it through their thick skulls? Voting your conscience is not a factor in this election. People who want to preserve their freedoms will vote for Bush. People who want to live under a dictatorship will vote for Gore or any of the third party candidates. You guys out there who are pushing Third Party are doing nothing but hurting yourselves and everybody else. None of them stand a snowball's chance in Hell of winning. If you guys want to push Third Party, go to a board full of Democrats and try to convince them. At least that way the votes will be pulled away from Gore. I better get off of my soapbox before I get mad and start cussing.

p.s. If the liberatarians were smart they'd use a self priming pump and they wouldn't have to worry about the bucket.

[This message has been edited by houndawg (edited July 08, 2000).]
 
"Short-sighted view", Randy? As opposed to being a kamikaze: giving it all up in a futile expression of "belief"? Harry Browne has no chance of being President. He has no power base, no political support, minimal financial backing . . . zip. He doesn't even have the notoriety or name recongnition that Jesse Ventura had. And even if he did get elected, Libertarians haven't invested the time, energy, and focus to secure enough seats in Congress to give him a voting bloc to aid the cause. The ultimate expression of short-sightedness is risking it all on a futile gamble, rather than engaging in a coherent, cohesive plan to retake this nation. Securing the Supreme Court is the key to that and placing three strict constructionist judges on the bench will do that better than any other option I've seen.

As for what I'll do when my grandchildren ask for my firearms, I don't have to worry about that. If it comes to that, I'll already be dead, hopefully, with empty mags to my right and left on a pile of casings, and my teeth buried in the throat of a jack booted thug.
 
Saw a bit of the libertarian convention, enought to hear a pro-rkba speech, and a 'let's stop the stupid war against drugs' speech. I'm pro-rkba, but I personally think the idea of decriminalizing hallucinigens is absurb. I get the idea from reading these posts that the libertarian party is being presented as a one issue platform - the right to keep and bear arms. There might be other reasons some of us aren't ready to sign on the whole libertarian idea; and that might be evidenced in the significant lack of libertarian officials at local and state levels.

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"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence. It is power. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearsome master." George Washington
 
I voted for Perot and got Klinton. BIG MISTAKE!

Of course, I WILL NOT vote for Gore, but, how do we know that G.W. isn't pulling the wool over our eyes, and won't have a "change of heart" after he's in? Maybe at the end of his 2nd term... :(
 
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