A "dumb" FFL holder?

S

Shootist45

New member
You were or are working for an FFL holder who has repeated mistakes on 4473's. You tried to correct the problem with training but, are always being stopped by management. The answer to being stopped was "because we do it this way".

You try to get a physical inventory done of all firearms in possession, due to "stories" of a gun being stolen, but are stopped by management, again.

The question is: should you report this FFL holder to the ATF? You have copies of the 4473's and witnesses to what you tried to do.

Interesting dilemma. How would you answer?
 
No dilemma at all for me personally...

I consider the ATF an unconstitutional entity. I consider all federal gun laws unconstitutional. The federal government has no power to infringe on the RKBA. Says so in the Constitution. Second amendment, I think.

I would not report this to the ATF. F 'em, sez I.

BTW - Why would "I" have copies of the 4473?
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shootist45:
You were or are working for an FFL holder who has repeated mistakes on 4473's. You tried to correct the problem with training but, are always being stopped by management. The answer to being stopped was "because we do it this way".

You try to get a physical inventory done of all firearms in possession, due to "stories" of a gun being stolen, but are stopped by management, again.

The question is: should you report this FFL holder to the ATF? You have copies of the 4473's and witnesses to what you tried to do.

Interesting dilemma. How would you answer?[/quote]

The very fact that you would consider turning "psuedo federal agent" on your employer who may be practicing civil disobedience against unconstitutional law says much about what you really understand about our situation as gun owners.

I would advise you to destroy these copies that you have of the 4473's (you may be in danger yourself of legal action just by possessing these federal papers), and get another job if you are afraid for yourself. If you employer is doing this purposefully, he has accepted the risks that discovery would bring.

If you are an advocate of freedom, DO NOT BE THE ONE TO RAT HIM OUT.

If he is not, then he's in for a big surprise when the ATF comes in and very ungraciously shuts him down.

We are at war. Which side are you on?

This issue is non-compromising.

BTW, welcome to TFL.com

------------------
John/az
"When freedom is at stake, your silence is not golden, it's yellow..." RKBA!

www.cphv.COM & www.handguncontrol.NET are being sued by Handgun Control, Inc.!

See the "cease and desist" letter here: www.cphv.com/lawsuit.html

[This message has been edited by John/az2 (edited November 01, 2000).]
 
Don't rat on him. If you have tried to get him to get in compliance with ATF rules and he continues to refuse, then get the hell out of there before he gets raided. Don't be a rat! By the way, why would you even consider turning him in?
 
They can't, as an FFL holder, destroy those forms. They have to be held on file for 20 years, and that's IF they stay in business for that long. If not the forms HAVE to be turned in to the ATF. Sounds like with employees that are ready to turn them in to the ATF that they won't be in business much longer though.
 
Hard to say. While I agree that the BATF actions and the 4473 crap are unconstitutional, it will also be your butt in jail if they catch wind of it. I would find another place to work.
 
Les see now...

All the Feds gotta do now is get Shootist45's ISP to supply a name... then they get the SSN... then they check on who his employer is... then the raid...

The damage is already done... arrrggghhhhh!!!

db

PS: I'd also suggest it may be appropriate to put up the 'agent provocateur' shields in this case..
 
Hear No Evil, See No Evil, Speak No Evil ;)
Most important one of all Do Not Co-Operate With Evil :eek:

------------------
We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
These sound like 'mistakes' on the part of the FFL holder and I can tell you that MANY of them do not know the laws that govern their business. Being stupid is no crime and he will pay the price during an audit, just don't be there and keep your mouth shut. IF on the other hand he has been making straw man sales, selling guns off the books, violating transfer laws, transferring a large number of the same make of firearm to the same person month after month, or is a S&W dealer and not complying with the terms of the agreement, you should report the violations immediately. An FFL holder who does these things is a criminal, gives us all a bad name, and should go to jail.
 
I wouldn't report him to the ATF, but I would quit. And I would tell the owner that he's risking jail time if he continues to business as is.

M1911
 
Shootist 45, or whomever you might be:

The 4473's, that you, an EMPLOYEE of a licensed business operation claim to have are the property of the business that employes you.

It starts out sounding as if you have STOLEN your employers property. Other aspects of the situation you described might indicate that the FFL holdrer isn't all that "swift", which is another matter eitirely. It seems however, that you might well be a thief, in addition to who knows what else.

Let him that is innocent, cast the first stone. The fact of you so much kicking at a rock is problematic, at best.
 
I think that you should distance yourself from this situation, ASAP. The moral decision to turn in or not is yours alone, but commoon sense dictates that you shouldn't continue to work for this guy if you feel he is acting innapropriately.


I also just started a loosley related thread here, under the title "an "Unscrupulous" FFL?"



------------------
-Essayons
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top