A Day at the Range

SgtLumpy

New member
Random thoughts and observations, positive and negative, from my day at Ben Avery, Phoenix. No particular message. Just observations...

For those not familiar, 67 position outdoor main range. Target holders from 5 to 200 yards. Concrete benches, shade, very good range control officers in the tower and roaming. Cost seven dollars per day per shooter.

- Range commands are excellent. Breaks every 15 minutes. Range commands over the PA are preceeded by a 5 second loud horn. The commands are repeated and clear/concise. Makes me feel comfortable that inexperienced shooters can hear and easily figure out what the range officers want us to do.

- Roaming range officers are easily identified in bright orange vests. They are all very helpful, friendly, never lose their cool even when faced with some pretty nerve wracking situations regarding muzzle discipline etc. I've had more than one of them help me, only when asked, to clear a jam or speculate what might be causing some kind of problem with a weapon. Any time I've been "corrected" for anything, they've never made me feel dumb or small. "Don't forget your glasses" or "Do you mind if I open the action on this rifle?" etc.

- Groups of college age kids...I always keep an extra eye on, and so do the ROs, this demographic. Yesterday there were 2 boys and 2 girls at one bench. The boys were doing a lot of "rapid bang bang" noise making. I have no problem with that. It's fun, even if expensive. They had targets at the closest distance but I'm not sure if they were aiming or cared if they hit them. One of the girls was texting while holding a loaded Glock in one hand. How do I know it was loaded? She fired a couple times, then picked up the phone to read and answer a text, then fired again. I got really close to getting anxious stepping in when it looked like her muzzle was about to sweep her unsuspecting neighbors. An RO saw the situation and he politely but firmly took care of her lack of focus problem.

- Very young kids...Table two spots to my right was a dad and his two young boys, very young teens, maybe less. I didn't see anyone do anything unsafe, but the two young boys were yelling really loud about "Dad, look at this" and "Hey Joey, [blah blah]". Just typical young boy stuff. Problem is that with neighbors in ear protection, we suddenly hear what sounds like someone screaming/yelling. I, and several neighbors, had to stop and get safe more than once to back up and observe if there was any kind of problem.

- Other frequent shooters...Several people that I see there all the time saw me and said "Hi Sarge. How you shootin' today?" or "What you shootin' today?" A couple came to my table when they saw me shooting 50 yards to ask questions. A couple of others came by when I was shooting "hostages" (two targets overlapping, one bad guy, one hostage...shoot the bad guy only).

- Someone had an accident...Somebody kissed the scope with their eye. Cut the skin, bled a little. The ROs were on it quickly and calmly with first aid, clean the bench and concrete floor. Then darned if the same guy didn't do it again a little while later.

- Here shoot my pistol...More than one person asked me to shoot their guns. I'm always honored by that. In some cases, they're asking me to verify their sight alignment or something. Other times I guess maybe they just want to let me shoot their gun (or maybe they just like my DI hat). I shot my neighbor's 22cal 1911 at my 50 yd targets. He left before I retrieved them. If you're out there, 1911 guy, I put 9 out of 10 on the 8" target.

- Not just kids...Elderly couple on the other end of the range. Man showing wife how to operate a 1911. He had a habit of keeping his finger on the trigger (I only assume safety on, but doesn't matter) while waving the gun around as if talking with his hands.

- Make it a day (or half day)...I tend to stay for the entire morning. 0700 to 1100 or 1200. Then I might go by a gun store to pick up anything I might need to clean guns later or whatever. I sometimes only shoot one cylinder or magazine full of ammo per range break. There's even times when I don't shoot at all during the 15 min live fire time. I just walk up and down the line and look at other guns and shooters. I see a lot of interesting pistol stances and often ask people about them. Some people don't stay that long. I've seen people come and setup sillouettes at 5 yards, fire a few rounds at it, then leave. Everyone's got different interests.


I guess the most important part of going to a range, or what makes it a good range, is the feeling that I'm safe there. Especially at a place with lots of benches, as this range does, I get that feeling. I've had that safe feeling at other ranges. Still others have made me so anxious that I leave after just one or two range breaks.


Shoot 'em up...bang bang


Sgt Lumpy
 
LOL... I am fortunate in that I can walk 200 yards out the back door and be on my own 200 yard range. But I shot quite a bit on unsupervised, state-maintained public ranges a few years ago and I watched in wonder as groups of 2-3 shooters would take turns loading magazines, while one of them would step to the line and empty those magazines as fast as they could jerk a trigger. 200 rounds would go downrange in a matter of 15 minutes, with volume of fire being the obvious goal.

They were having just a hell of a good time exercising their Constitutional rights and I got a kick out of watching them. I also got pretty handy at watching them and absent a range officer, we policed ourselves. It got a little tense at times.
 
Nice range report. I liked the description of your range and the procedures.

It's a good example to non-gun folk that shooting can be fun ;) and even safe :eek:.

Sometimes I think we need a reminder of that ourselves.

(PS Pictures would be nice.)
 
Went to the range on saturday and was "assaulted by the local range ninja" if you know what I mean.

Started going over my posture (i was sitting) and wanted me to let out my stock more... which is funny because I have a non-adjustable rifle length stock. Said he would never shoot with only iron sights like I do, but would put a 9x magnification on my 5.56 AR (what a waste of glass). Showed me pictures of shooting his AR he bought and built for less than $600 in CA (yeah right). He put a "can" on the end so that it looked like a suppressor. Recommended that I buy a chinese made Eotech for $90, because they're the same quality as American, or get a Northstar because its a cheaper Leupold.

Asked me about my build, mentioned LMT and Noveske and CMMG parts. Said he wasn't familiar with those, but kept on saying "stag arms" over and over again.

:rolleyes:
 
Thanks for sharing, Sgt Lumpy.

I, too, often shoot at Ben Avery (though not likely as often or long as you) and have enjoyed it a great deal. Polite, pleasant Range Officers. Well executed time management protocols (cease fires) and fairly consistent application and enforcement of range rules.

We've seen mostly good behaviour, people occassionally reminded to 'step behind the yellow line' during cease-fires, but never any unsafe behaviour.
 
Maybe its how it was written, but is it really that they have an airhorn going off every fifteen minutes? That would be disconcerting. Fifteen minutes of shooting time then another break sounds a little light as well, but thats just me.


Also the kids typing on IPhones. Judging from my kids, you will never pry them away from those. Its both humorous and alarming. Just wait until someone shows up with Google Glasses...:eek:
 
Maybe its how it was written, but is it really that they have an airhorn going off every fifteen minutes? That would be disconcerting.

Yes, cease-fires are [after] every fifteen minutes [of live-fire]. One does get used to the cadence quite quickly.

The cease-fire is preceeded by a loudspeaker announcement 1minute prior to the cease fire: "One minute warning. One minute warning." People are thus expecting the air-horn.
 
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Yes the horn preceeds the verbal cease fire command. It's not an air horn, like on a diesel truck. Something electronic. Not scary sounding. Just sets the stage. Lets you know that the range break is happening. And the commands are repeated, expectable, and consitant every time. Doesn't matter who the control officer is...they surely use a script. So even if you can't hear the exact words, you KNOW what they're saying because of the cadence of the spoken words.

"CEASE FIRE, CEASE FIRE...UNLOAD ALL FIREARMS, REMOVE ALL MAGAZINES...etc"

And just to clarify, there's a 15 minute live fire separated by breaks. ie, it doesn't happen at 00 15 30 and 00 minutes. You shoot for 15 min, then there's a range break. The break could last 5 min or 10 min or however long it takes for everyone to take care of their targets. If there's only a few pistol shooters with very close in targets, the break is only a couple of minutes. If there's a lot of 200 yard rifle guys, the break would last longer. After the break, the 15 minute live fire time starts the clock again.




Sgt Lumpy
 
Now With Pictures!

Ben Avery Shooting Facility, Phoenix
Sunday June 23, 2013

Took my friend shooting. Last weekend he shot BB guns at his kid's scout camp. Some time about a year ago he shot a magazine or so from someone's AR. Other than that, the last thing he shot was 40 yrs ago when he was a kid, shot a 22 pump rifle and pheasant load shotguns in S Dakota.

This guy did amazing! I familiarized him a bit about the gun(s), made sure he understood what the range officers wanted in terms of muzzle discipline etc, and simply said "Kill the sillhouette".

He immediately shot fist sized groups at 5 yards in the 5 zone, center mass. I had him skip load the revolver, shoot 2 chest-1 head, reload, 5 to 25 yards. Every round on target. Excellent shot!

We shot one sillhouette with all the guns (38, 357, snub, beretta 9mm) at all distances out to 25, then repeated with a fresh target. Both targets were excellent. He took 'em home to put on the wall of his man cave. Then he bought me lunch and asked me all about buying a revolver, gun safe, ammo etc. I think we've got a convert here.

PICS FOLLOW...

First shots. 38s through a model 66. No instruction as to stance, grip etc. Darn good looking, solid arm platform, I'd say.

BrettShoot-01.jpg



His target is on the LEFT. His groups were all exactly where he'd call them. Again, checkout that head upright, solid arm platform, good point. All natural. Nobody taught him how to hold the thing.

BrettShoot-02.jpg




Big farmboy dwarfs little Chief's Special. Almost caught the photo in mid fire. Hammer's on the way back. Dbl action.

BrettShoot-03.jpg





Sgt Lumpy
 
More Range Pics

Here's some general pics of the range and some of the people. It was Sunday. Lots of families, kids. Not too many of the serious shooters that I see there during the week. Everyone very safe.


These two pics I'm trying to show the size of the range. There's sixty-something shooting positions. The control tower is in the middle. So you're looking at half of the shooter positions. There's another 30-something on the OTHER side of the control box.

BASF-01.jpg



BASF-02.jpg




Lots of this. Little girl and her even younger sister were really good shots. One gun was a 22 other was a regular AR 223.

BASF-03.jpg



Lady and her pink AR. She also had some kind of pink bottom feeder handgun. Both her and her husband seemed really comfortable with their guns, like they shoot them a lot. Good shots out to 100 yards with the open sighted ARs.

BASF-04.jpg





10 1/2 inch 44 Mag. Both dad and the little kid shot it. Kept trying to get a shot of the kid but the picture moment just never presented itself. Both dad and kid were shooting this big SA gun at 50 yards. I heard the dad calling the kid's shots through the scope. Kid was hitting the 7 ring.

BASF-06.jpg


BASF-07.jpg



Sgt Lumpy
 
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And I'll be there again tomorrow morning, Wednesday, June 26th. Gotta practice up to get that new guy off my heels...:D


Sgt Lumpy
 
And here's how I did...

Hoping to see some of youz guyz from Phoenix...:cool:

Target-01-6-26-2013.jpg



Target-02-6-26-2013.jpg



Target-03-6-26-2013.jpg



The target pasters you see here and there were from my K22. It's not nearly as accurate (I'm not nearly as accurate with it) as my M66.

"Rapid", in this case means 1 round per second or faster.
"Slow", in this case means 1 round every TWO seconds or faster.
All double action. All 158 gr JSP Magnums.


Sgt Lumpy
 
Ben Avery, Phoenix.

That is a handsome looking range.

With another thread going on about backstops and ranges I think you've got that issue covered at yours.

Also that's some pretty nice .357 shooting too.
 
I lived out that way as a youngster.
And visited awhile back.
Ben Avery has to be one of the nicest ranges anywhere.
The indoor range at Scottsdale Gun Club is mighty fine, too.
Lots of good places to shoot in that area.
Didn't there used to be another outdoor public one, south of Phoenix, up in the hills?
Not the big club range, east of town in the mountains, where some of the major matches are held, but south.
 
gwil:
Yeah, there's two outdoor ranges south of town. I haven't been to either one. One of them is having internal political problems (who wants to be in charge). The other is a lot of miles down the Rocky Point highway. Neither is as large as Ben Avery.


Dale:
It does indeed have a huge backstop and really high side berms/block walls. Still there's a lot of holes in the overhead support structure for the shade over the shooting benches. So somebody apparently manages to fire up into the air, through the roof. Over by the trap/skeet ranges, the prison is downrange and off to the side. If you break out of jail, you either have to swim across the lake, or navigate across the skeet range.


Sgt Lumpy
 
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