9 mm case bulge

M

Mustang111

Inactive
I am attempting to load a Berry's 124 gr. .356, Hollow base blunt nose using Lee dies in a Rockchucker press. I have sized, primed, expanded, and seated the round. The problem is no matter how deeply I seat the bullet, the case has bulged to the depth to which the round was seated. I have checked to make sure the dies are correct. The sizing and expander dies were screwed in to the shell holder. I set bullets to different depths to check for the depth of the bulge and no matter how deeply the bullet was set, the bulge went to that depth. There was no see for crimp.
 
As long as they pass the plunk test in your guns barrell there is no problem. Sometimes i get a bulge even on .355 rounds. They plunk = they fire. I have even used .357 147gr xtremes...i get more rejects than the smaller bullets but i just shoot them up as range ammo. Even the rejects typically shoot fine but i wont use them in a match. YMMV

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Not uncommon to fail the headspace gage as well on those .356ers. If they pass the kerplunk test like stated above, then make 3-4 dummy round and see if you can load them via the slide in the magazine. If they fail to load, then try another bullet type or another manual that lists a different OAL w/ their powder levels and work up from start.
 
Yep I've experienced "wasp waist" 9mm reloads before. And like the fellers above said, as long as they chamber freely, pass the "Plunk Test" you're good to go. If you use lead bullets, but you mentioned plated so this is for future reference, pull a bullet after seating/crimping and measure the diameter. Just to make sure the case/process is not swaging the bullet down...
 
It's the sizer die. Sizes to .3555" ID on the case mouth. Don't worry about the bulge.
"...but you mentioned plated..." Treated like a cast bullet.
 
Do they fit into your barrel ok after you resized them? Do you flare them as little as possible? Those are the two things I would concentrate on first. Also make sure none of your flare remains, even if you don't crimp much you can't have any left.
 
If they'll chamber, they're fine.

It's just the sizing die sizing the cases too small. You're using a carbide die, right? ;)

My dies do it. I'll post an image as soon my phone uploads.
Here ya go. Not the best picture, but you can see quite a few "wasp waists" in there:

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If you find that you want to load a lot of those 356-ers, the Lyman "M" die makes for an easier insertion of the flat based brass. They are a "friendly flare" so to speak. Where a normal flaring die flares the brass just enough to hold it when you turn it upside down and then force spreads the brass as the bullet is seated, the "M" die makes for a smoother transistion into the seated position.
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http://www.midwayusa.com/product/600695/lyman-neck-expander-m-die-9mm-380-acp-38-super
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There are ou tube videos to give you a better idea. You can load thousands w/o the "M" die. It's just another aspect in the reloading world that is done just for the fun of it.
 
Wasp wait 9mm reloads

I am using carbide dies and my loads look,very similar to those posted. The rounds will chamber but will eject with great difficulty, if the slide is pulled prior to firing. Also, if I separate the barrel from the gun, XDM Compact, the rounds will not quite drop all,the way into,the barrel or drop out if the barrel is upended as a factory round would. So these are safe to fire ?
 
Whenever there is a fit problem, measure. Measure the diameter of the finished round in a few places. Is any measurement out of spec., too big? Measure the OAL. Mark the bullet and case on one of your reloads and chamber it, looking for where the bullet or case hits before complete chambering. Your reloads should fall into the chamber, all the way, and drop out, by them selves, just like factory ammo...

Unsafe? Can't answer that without more info on where the round is too big...
 
The rounds have to drop in the chamber to function correctly. It's called the plunk test because it makes a "plunk" sound when done correctly. You should not be getting anything but the very slightest bulge on 9mms, no matter what the bullet shape, material, or weight. Here are 4 different 9mm's that I load on a regular basis, no bulge.

124 Montana Gold JHP, Bayou 125 TC, Hornady XTP 125, Bear Creek 125 RN

image37275.jpg
 
Mustang, "There was no see for crimp." does that mean you did not crimp the rounds?? They won't function without a crimp (which is really a de-belling step from the powder thru funnel expander). Necked cases can get by with just the slightest of crimp, almost none, but not tapered rounds like the 9mm. They need an actual crimp.

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Safe, unsafe?
From your description, it sounds for sure it's at least suspicious.
There's so many manufacturers of 9mm guns, ammo, brass, dies and all the rest, it's not surprising to run across an anomaly or two.
There might not a thing wrong with any single part of what you are doing, but maybe there's a stacked effect of some kind.
Thick walled brass comes to mind along with dies that run to the small side of what is considered spec.
Careful measurement of everything pertinent would be advisable.

P.S.
Aren't those some bulges in 9x45's sample pictures?
Not that they are any problem, necessarily.
I've loaded a lot of similar looking 9mms, but they functioned as expected.
 
If the slide is going into battery then I would think they are safe to shoot. The power of the slide spring is forcing them into the chamber but are hard to eject because that spring power is against you and the round is stuck. Sounds more and more like you need to crimp, at least some. I would start by screwing the die in about 1/4 turn at a time until you start to feel resistance. That is the crimp. Try it
 
If the slide is going into battery then I would think they are safe to shoot. The power of the slide spring is forcing them into the chamber but are hard to eject because that spring power is against you and the round is stuck. Sounds more and more like you need to crimp, at least some. I would start by screwing the die in about 1/4 turn at a time until you start to feel resistance. That is the crimp. Try it
Click to expand...

I second this^^^^^^^

Sound like there is just a hair of bell being left on the case mouth.
You may not be able to see it but it is there.
 
That's from the bullets bringing the case mouth back to normal diameter, after being sized too small by the sizing die.
Click to expand...
Which explains why they still work without a hassle.
And explains why loading with .357 bullets looked suspicious but worked just fine.
Life is so confusing.
 
If the slide is going into battery then I would think they are safe to shoot. The power of the slide spring is forcing them into the chamber but are hard to eject because that spring power is against you and the round is stuck. Sounds more and more like you need to crimp, at least some. I would start by screwing the die in about 1/4 turn at a time until you start to feel resistance. That is the crimp. Try it
Click to expand...
Not if the bullet is being jammed into the rifling or the case is forced into the throat...
 
I'm not sure if this has been discussed.

Remember a few things. Trust, the 9was designed with a bit of a taper. Carbide dies don't taper the fired case, it just sizes it down to just above the web, into a straight tube. Sometimes you will see a ring there. His process puts the external dimensions right.

Then you expand, so the internal dimensions will take the bullet, and the case is flared, so it will start without damaging the base.

Then you apply a taper crimp. Your nine works by holding the south of the case against the chamber mouth, and a taper allows the rim of the case to stay square. After you use your taper crime, now the entire length of brass that is covered by the bullet shank has been pressed by the bullet.

Every step in this process leaves a bit of variation. Low at the base, higher at the base of the bullet, then another squeeze at the mouth. My .380 rounds, using rcbs dies, look like a caterpillar. All of those bulbs happen in about a half inch.
 
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