6" Duty Guns?

M

Model12Win

Moderator
Hello everyone! I am wondering if revolvers with 6" barrels were used by Law Enforcement, specifically in the last 40 or so years.

I know that in the early 20th century, the 6" barrel length was fairly common but also know the 4" barrel came to be quite popular by the middle of the century or so. I haven't found too much on police revolver usage with barrels over 6" in length after that time.

Do you know of any departments or agencies who issued 6" bbl'd guns in the '70s, 80's, even '90s? Also, do you know of any individual officers who were authorized to and who carried such guns? I am very interested in the history of the Law Enforcement revolver, especially the more recent history.

Thanks!
 
Well, the old TV show "Adam 12" shows both officers carrying 6" Model 14 S&W's with the LAPD. That was in the 70's or so. Yea, it's a TV show, but it was pretty accurate in regards to equipment. Later on they transistioned to the 4" Model 15.

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Adam-12#Smith_.26_Wesson_Model_14

I don't know for sure that this one was a cops gun, but it wouldn't surprise me. Made in 1965 it shows plenty of wear, but is still tight. The name "Trooper" tells you what market it was aimed at.

 
I think automobiles made the 6" less popular due to having to sit in a car for hours at a time. Sitting with a 6" barrel isn't comfortable. Some tried to mitigate it with swivel holsters, but most went to the 4" pretty quick.
 
LAPD cops were often seen with 6" 38 revolvers. No doubt other agencies around the country used them as well but due to the TV and films usually being based in SoCal the LAPD guns were most seen. They were usually target grade revolvers like the Model 14 S&W or the Colt Officers Model Target. The thinking was to carry an accurate pistol and the 6" barrel wrung maximum velocity from the 38 Special cartridge.

I don't know where he served, but my good friend's late father in law was a retired police officer and he carried a 6" Colt Official Police on duty. I have a 5" Colt revolver stamped St Louis PD. I have a 6" S&W Model 14-3 made in 1969 that exhibits extreme holster wear and the stocks were all beat to hell in a pattern that is typical of duty pistols. While I can't say for certain, I strongly suspect the gun was once a duty revolver.

I grew up in California and 6" revolvers were commonly seen on CHP officers' belts. The 6" Python was a status symbol amongst the experienced CHP cops. Duty holsters were made that could be unsnapped allowing the unit to swivel and lay parallel to the thigh while seated as otherwise a long barrel makes it tough to sit in a car.

After the infamous Newhall shooting in 1970 where 4 CHP officers were gunned down many changes were made in that agency's policies. Officers were no longer authorized to carry 357 Magnums because it was thought most couldn't shoot them accurately (I didn't share that opinion after watching a group of them at the range one day) and a custom S&W revolver was designed specifically for the CHP (also adopted by the LAPD and L.A. Sheriff's Office). The Model 68 was a K frame, stainless 38 Special with a 6" barrel and a shrouded ejector rod. It was essentially a Model 66 in 38 Special. These guns were never cataloged or marketed to the public.

Often the officers took their revolvers when they retired and when they all switched to semi autos some of the 38s were sold as surplus so they do turn up for sale once in a while and collectors grab them.

Bottom line, the 4" revolvers were by far more popular amongst LEOs but the 6" guns were used in numbers.
 
I carried a 6" python from 1976 until the 90's when I went to "plain clothes" most counties issued 6" model 19's and the State Patrol carried 6" 27's.

The switch to auto's started in the late 80's but a few of us dinosaurs continued to carry [with department permission] what we were use to.

Funny anecdote: Last Saturday we had annual "Qualification". These days I carry either a 2" model 10 or a 1911, depending on circumstances. Just for kicks I dusted off and brought my PPC gun [Davis conversion model 10] and ran the course with it as well. The reaction of the younger guys and gals [all off them are] was priceless….. One of them asked…"Hey were did you get the Snake Plisken gun?"

Mike
 
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I got into police work while revolvers were still commonly being issued in my state (CA).

I saw a lot of personally-owned revolvers with 6+" barrels being carried (.38Spl, .357 Mag, .45 Colt, .45 ACP & .44 Mag or Spl), but the issued guns were 4" models at my agency. Why? Because it's easier to sit in a patrol car with a holstered 4" revolver, especially if a standard belt holster is being used. ;)

The guys carrying the 6" - 6 1/2" revolvers were mostly using standard or Buscadero rigs with extended drop shanks and swivels, so they could shift them alongside their thighs while seated. (I saw some guys who still had leather hammer loops for retention, instead of thumb break straps, too.)

My closest friend worked in the CHP up & down the state, serving as a weapons officer for many years. He'd started when revolvers were issued (and personally-owned ones authorized), and then after the M4006's were issued and required carry for uniform duty. He also served as a weapons officer at some different field offices where he was assigned.

He told me that during the revolver days, as time went by the use of .357 Magnum depended on the policy at the field office level (run by a captain). Some approved the use of (and stocked) .357 Magnum ammunition, and some didn't. He carried both Magnum and .38 Spl (issued 110gr +P+), depending on the particular field office policy and ammunition availability. He carried some different revolvers, too. He said that if Magnum was authorized by a particular field office, any officers wishing to carry it had to qualify with it (using issued Magnum loads).

FWIW, he also told me that when he worked for one field office, 10mm was approved for off-duty carry, but the only ammunition approved was the W-W 175gr STHP, which was stocked and issued for a few officers who owned 10mm guns at that office.
 
Barrels over 6" in length add weight the copper has to lug around on his pants. Few police firearms ever get fired, but they do get carried a lot. Every ounce matters. And it's easier to sit in a patrol car.
The name "Trooper" is nothing but marketing. Highway Patrol Trooper at that. Has nothing whatever to do with anything else.
"...after watching a group of them at the range..." Most cops never shoot their service piece except for annual qualification. Most of 'em would not be able to shoot a .357 accurately. The days of cops being 'gun guys' or ever having seen a real firearm prior to being hired are long gone.
 
I was at a range used by cops in CA and watched a group of CHP officers shooting their Pythons. Mixed lot of 4" and 6" guns. Not a qualification, they were just shooting. A couple were in full uniform and the rest in everyday clothing.

Those guys could shoot pretty good. One of them (in uniform) was drawing, firing six rounds and reloading for another six shots incredibly fast.

I recall one day a suspect barricaded himself in a house about 100 yards from where I worked. The first PD officer to arrive was shot through the side window as he shut off his cruiser. He slumped over on the seat and wasn't discovered until it was all over hours later. For a couple hours the house was surrounded by city police, sheriffs deputies and CHP officers. Then the window shattered and the suspect began shooting at the cops from inside the house. They all opened up on him. It was boom-boom-boom of the 38s punctuated by the BOOMS of the 357s the CHP cops were using.

The shooter was hit several times and died at the scene.

I forgot to add that I have a S&W pre-war "Registered Magnum" originally shipped to the Utah Highway Patrol in 1938. One of 50 mine is factory engraved "Utah Highway Patrol 27." they were shipped with 6" barrels and in the late 1940s and early 1950s all were sent back to S&W and had the barrels cut to 4" length. Within a couple years they were replaced by 3.5" 357s.
 
Yes almost all 'Department Issue/Approved" ammo was 38spl+p or +p+.. And aside from liability no one really needs, or needed magnums for the work. Good decisions and accuracy were/are significantly more important.

Lucky enough to live near Hoyt and had my break fronts built with a reverse cant… easier/quicker out and easier on the ribs while seated. [kinda wore out the upholstery quicker though].

Yea…. none of us could shoot a lick?????…. Well in reality we could and some still do.

"Haters gotta hate" as that young singer/songwriter so eloquently stated.

Mike
 
I worked with a Houston uniformed officer for a few months about 25 years ago. He was a stereotypical big beefy flat-foot cop who carried a 6" N-frame in 45 Colt. I asked him why such a chunk of a gun and he replied if he shot 'em or smacked 'em, the BG fell right down. He was the last of the "slapjack era" cops I knew. He was a very nice guy but no one to play with.
 
When I started on the job I was issued a 4" skinny barrel S&W Model 10, but everyone carried a 6" Model 19, 66 or Python. I saved from my first five pay checks and bought a used 6" Model 66 and carried it in an A.E. Nelson break front holster with 2 speed loaders for the next 10 years until I switched to Beretta 92.
 
I carried a 6" Colt Python from March of 1979 to about August 1982 as an armed private security officer. Due to spending a lot of time in a patrol car or at a desk I decided a 4" barrel might work better for me. My next duty weapon was a 4" S&W 28-2.
 
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The last 6" revolver I saw "on duty" was in 1984 on the belt of a Philly Metro officer, with the typical, well worn swivel holster. Older guy, heavy set, the leather rig looked ancient. Likely close to retirement, nice enough guy I guess. Probably had seen a rash of stuff. Most of metro guys seemed to hold us "park guards" at a distance, but this guy was conversational enough. I was working the Liberty Bell/Inde Park

I noticed his thumbreak was unsnapped, and commented, discreetly, on same.

His response..."Yeah, I know". Right, got it. New subject.
 
Post #15 reminds me of the cop carrying a cocked and locked 1911. Approached by a citizen horrified at the sight of a cocked handgun in the cop's holster he said "That gun is dangerous!"

Cop's response: "Damn right."
 
Yeah LOL!

Well after I buy my S&W 686 w/ 6 inch barrel, I'm going to get a Tex Shoemaker "Walking Dead" swivel holster. Yeah I know, sort of dorky, but it's specifically made for a longer barreled revolver (like Rick's Python in the show) and Tex Shoemaker makes great holsters. I just didn't know how realistic it was to have a 6" revolver as a duty gun in the first place. Seems like it was certainly done, even right up till the mass adoption of semi-auto pistols.
 
While in the 1970's the county police issued 5" revolvers with a 6" swivel holster (never could figure the logic in that) the county Sheriff's office authorized 4"-5"-6" within certain brands but had to be .38spl. capable. No .357 mag ammo. No pearl/ivory/stag grips. I preferred the 4" model 64 as it would clear leather faster than a longer bbl. guns and were easier(lighter) to wear all day long. And yes, certain deputies preferred 6" Colt's Pythons.Still have my duty gun in the safe. tom. :cool:
 
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