6.5 CM FPS
- Thread starter Snipe
- Start date
Assuming your range is stable (the target not moving nearer or farther away during shooting) and your gun has the accuracy you are claiming, then wind deflection and, for some bullet designs, dropping below the speed of sound before arriving at the target are your only concerns. Wind deflection and loss of velocity on the way to the target will vary inversely with the BC of your bullet, so if the bullet BC is high enough you will be fine, as any ballistic calculator can confirm one way or the other.
Since you didn't say what bullet you are using, those principles are all I can give you. If you detail the whole load (case, powder and charge weight, primer, and bullet) we may be able to provide other suggestions.
Since you didn't say what bullet you are using, those principles are all I can give you. If you detail the whole load (case, powder and charge weight, primer, and bullet) we may be able to provide other suggestions.
I have found that my 6.5mm CMs shoot more accurately with slower powders like H4350, IMR 4451, IMR4350 and Reloader 17. Classic .308 powders like Varget, H4895, and IMR4064 haven't produced the best accuracy for me in my 6.5mm CMs.
The best results with an individual powder depends upon the bullet weight. RL-17 seems to produce its best results with the 130 grain bullets and then accuracy drops off with bullet weight. RL-17 Muzzle velocity with 130 bullets is around 2800 fps and with 140 grain bullets around 2763 fps.
H4350 and IMR4451 produced the most accurate results for me with 140 to 147 grain bullets. They also are accurate at 130 grains as well.
Muzzle velocities run around 2702 to 2723 with 130 grain bullets, 2663 to 2688 with 140 grain bullets, 2662 to 2685 with 142 grain bullets, and 2638 to 2660 with 147 grain bullets. H4350 produces the higher velocities and IMR4451 produces the lower velocities.
I tend to agree that 2450 fps muzzle velocity is probably too slow for 1000 yard shooting. I would try a slower burning powder and see if you get better results and higher muzzle velocities.
The best results with an individual powder depends upon the bullet weight. RL-17 seems to produce its best results with the 130 grain bullets and then accuracy drops off with bullet weight. RL-17 Muzzle velocity with 130 bullets is around 2800 fps and with 140 grain bullets around 2763 fps.
H4350 and IMR4451 produced the most accurate results for me with 140 to 147 grain bullets. They also are accurate at 130 grains as well.
Muzzle velocities run around 2702 to 2723 with 130 grain bullets, 2663 to 2688 with 140 grain bullets, 2662 to 2685 with 142 grain bullets, and 2638 to 2660 with 147 grain bullets. H4350 produces the higher velocities and IMR4451 produces the lower velocities.
I tend to agree that 2450 fps muzzle velocity is probably too slow for 1000 yard shooting. I would try a slower burning powder and see if you get better results and higher muzzle velocities.
Sorry guys I was using 39.4 grains of h4350 it held .173 of group at 100 yards on a 53 degree day but when the temp went up the group went to .445. I switched to varget 33.6 grains holds .153 of group 2553 fps.
Defiance deviant action McMillan stock 28 inch kreiger 1-8 twist night force scope
Sierra SMK 142 Peterson brass cci400 primmers
I'm trying to get it up to 2700 now but at the slower speed the groups are great
Defiance deviant action McMillan stock 28 inch kreiger 1-8 twist night force scope
Sierra SMK 142 Peterson brass cci400 primmers
I'm trying to get it up to 2700 now but at the slower speed the groups are great
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if I were you I would forget the 1000 yard stuff. You need to take that rifle to short range benchrest matches. Sounds like you could easily be the running for national champion. Love to see you show those 6 PPC guys how it's done
https://internationalbenchrest.com/...ents/Holton MI IBS Group Nationals 081219.pdf
https://internationalbenchrest.com/...ents/Holton MI IBS Group Nationals 081219.pdf
kilotanker22
New member
How many shots In your groups? 3, 5, 10? How many times have you shot those groups with those types of results?
If you are worried about velocity, H-4350 will get you a lot more than where you are. Especially with a 28 inch tube. Just because it shoots really well with your current loads. Does not mean it won't shoot equally well at 2800-2900 fps. The only way to know for sure is to try it.
For reference, I get 2814 avg velocity, with a SD of 5 fps and ES of 14 fps out of a 24 inch tube. Using H-4350 and a 140 grain ELD. It will group 3 rounds in the 1's pretty regularly, 5 rounds in the .3" range and 10 rounds about .5"-.8" depending on what kind of day I am having.
If you are worried about velocity, H-4350 will get you a lot more than where you are. Especially with a 28 inch tube. Just because it shoots really well with your current loads. Does not mean it won't shoot equally well at 2800-2900 fps. The only way to know for sure is to try it.
For reference, I get 2814 avg velocity, with a SD of 5 fps and ES of 14 fps out of a 24 inch tube. Using H-4350 and a 140 grain ELD. It will group 3 rounds in the 1's pretty regularly, 5 rounds in the .3" range and 10 rounds about .5"-.8" depending on what kind of day I am having.
Varget is not a good choice for 6.5 CM. H4350 is the cult classic choice for 6.5 CM, but there are several others in that burn rate that can be good. I started with H4350 and haven't really had much reason to try anything else.
I did experiment briefly with Ramshot Hunter when it looked like I might run out of H4350. Initial results looked good, but that is about the time I was able to find a good supply of H4350 and I never went back to it.
Never tried it, but I've read good things about RL17 and RL26 as well as IMR4451
I did experiment briefly with Ramshot Hunter when it looked like I might run out of H4350. Initial results looked good, but that is about the time I was able to find a good supply of H4350 and I never went back to it.
Never tried it, but I've read good things about RL17 and RL26 as well as IMR4451
kilotanker22
New member
I can vouch for RL26 and IMR 4451 in the Creedmoor. Reloder 26 had excellent velocity with a good spread. IMR 4451 was accurate, but lacking in velocity.
In the late 1800s guys shot 1,000 yard matches with .45 caliber rifles iron sights, and black powder.
It's not like your bullet doesn't have the speed to get there, after all...
where you need to be looking (besides mastering the wind drift) is if your bullet goes subsonic before it gets to the 1,000 yd target, and where it happens.
Bullets destabilize a bit when they go subsonic, but restabilize some distance later. You want your bullet to either be trans-sonic when it hits the 1,000 yd target, OR go subsonic far enough before the target to restabilize and then hit the target.
or so I've heard.
It's not like your bullet doesn't have the speed to get there, after all...
where you need to be looking (besides mastering the wind drift) is if your bullet goes subsonic before it gets to the 1,000 yd target, and where it happens.
Bullets destabilize a bit when they go subsonic, but restabilize some distance later. You want your bullet to either be trans-sonic when it hits the 1,000 yd target, OR go subsonic far enough before the target to restabilize and then hit the target.
or so I've heard.
Peyton,
I show your bullet still at 1278 fps at 1000 yards, which is still supersonic at sea level. As compared to 2700 fps, that would arrive on target at almost 1400 fps, which is better, as some transonic phenomena can show below 1400 fps on some bullets. I just never heard the 142-grain SMK is one of them. Windage will require about 10% more correction than the 2700 fps load would. So I think this will work at 1000.
I show your bullet still at 1278 fps at 1000 yards, which is still supersonic at sea level. As compared to 2700 fps, that would arrive on target at almost 1400 fps, which is better, as some transonic phenomena can show below 1400 fps on some bullets. I just never heard the 142-grain SMK is one of them. Windage will require about 10% more correction than the 2700 fps load would. So I think this will work at 1000.