50/50 Beeswax/Crisco question.

D

dlw

Inactive
Newbe here. Just bought a Remington 1858 New Army Brass BP (Pietta).
Haven't fired it yet. Still trying to find powder locally.
Very few gundealers have anything around here. SW Washington State.

Anyway, I understand the 50/50 mix is used, in addition to a lubricant, to prevent 'chain firing.' My question is, will this 50/50 mix also 'drip' and cause a mess in the holster, down my leg, on my boots or on the floor (LOL) on a warm to hot day?

TIA
dlw
 
The good part is ...50/50 mix of Crisco / beeswax is too thick for winter use ...So durning the cold and cooler months Crisco is all thats needed ......but durning the Summer a thicker blend works best to keep it off your gunleather and leg .
Summer is right around the corner so you might mix a little on the thick side ...you won`t know until the mix cools down just how thick it is . it`s just something you have to play with untill you get it right , I add a little veggie oil or olive oil when the wife isn`t looking to thin my mix until I get it just right , be sure and not put all your beeswax in the first batch , you`ll need some just incase you need to make it thicker .
I started out useing the store bought bore butter in a tube ....after a few mins in the hot sun ...the bore butter was liquid bore butter .
 
I've just about convinced myself that there is no such thing as "chain fire" from the cylinder muzzle as long as you get a shaved ring all the way around when seating the ball. But...I guess you could play it safe. Seems like that lube over the ball trick is more mess than I'm willing to deal with. Why not just use a lubricated felt wad between the powder and the ball. And...while I'm at it I'd propose that lube is just to keep black powder fouling soft as to not cause accuracy problems after awhile because of fouling. When I say "black powder" I mean the real McCoy, not a substitute. It would seem that 777 powder does not foul like black powder and the residue is actually somewhat soft and has lubricating properties of its own. Therefore, technically with 777, you don't need lube whatsoever. There are other black powder substitutes too if you can't find black powder. I suggested one of them above.

Wonder Wads

I know you didn't ask for the info/opinion I provided but it's there just in case you didn't previously consider it or perhaps to help out the next guy who reads this thread. FWIW....
 
I use a 50/50 mixture of beeswax (toilet ring, a cheap man's version) and Parafin wax with a little olive oil to keep it soft. And in the summer it hasn't ran down my legs, uet. It does get soft on those really hot days. And I will admit they want to stick together in my little baggie. But for overall use, it has been good for me and a lot cheaper than the wonder wads. But it is a personal preference.
 
Here is a good article on the issue.

Multiple Discharges in Percussion Revolvers

In short, it's the percussion cap end of the cylinder that will give you a chain fire. Loose or missing caps, nipples that are too long, etc.

original Colt ads never made any mention of grease over the balls. You also don't see it used in photographs of the era. (Even in the 1860's they were pointing guns at cameras.:p
 
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Here is a good article on the issue.
Click to expand...

Hey, that's a good writeup on a great experiment. I think it might be time for us to dis-spell the chain fire myth by linking to such articles every time there is mention of putting lube over the ball to prevent chain fires.
 
I think it might be time for us to dis-spell the chain fire myth by linking to such articles every time there is mention of putting lube over the ball to prevent chain fires.
Click to expand...

I've got one that'll chain fire every time if you don't either use over ball lube or wads. You can even cap one chamber at a time and it won't chain as long as the balls are lubed.
 
I've got one that'll chain fire every time if you don't either use over ball lube or wads. You can even cap one chamber at a time and it won't chain as long as the balls are lubed.
Click to expand...

Oh course my point is I am in agreement with the author who pointed out the following:

2. You are in danger of having a multiple discharge:

* if the balls you are using are too small or are damaged/wrinkled.
* if you have a heavily pitted chamber.
* if you keep loosing caps while shooting.
* if you have too long nipples, perhaps in combination with either:
o a. caps that are not seated on the nipples or
o b. nipples that are not properly fastened (it makes them longer, same as a).
* if you ignore the other points and depend on greased chambers to prevent any chainfire.

I would assume your firearm is having one of the issue listed above. I'll take a SWAG...heavy pitting or perhaps a cylinder is deformed?...or you got gremlins? ;)
 
Hey. Speaking of a chain fire waiting to happen. I have a ROA that I got really cheap because of the rust and pitting. It is one nasty piece. And I am loading .454 balls. Now I do use a lube pill. It destroys about 50% of the caps upon firing. So I have three of the dangers covered. And that silly revolver shoots fine. And is fairly accurate. And I have yet to experience a chain fire.

So I am interested in what Hawg has to offer. No way he is shooting a revolver in worse condition than mine? It's the Ugly Gun Contest.:D:D
 
First off you have to go to Oregon to get powder.

Chairman Christine has made the transportation of black powder a crime, so no one will import it any more.

Secondly, use wads between the powder and ball, and again between the ball and end of the cylinder.

That way no spark can get anywhere close to the powder charges
 
In short, it's the percussion cap end of the cylinder that will give you a chain fire. Loose or missing caps, nipples that are too long, etc.
Click to expand...

You published the link to the article but completely missed the conclusion. Go back and reread the bullet points at the end. Both sets.
 
Yup, he didn't include this part in his summary:

2. You are in danger of having a multiple discharge:

* if the balls you are using are too small or are damaged/wrinkled.
* if you have a heavily pitted chamber.
* if you keep loosing caps while shooting.
* if you have too long nipples, perhaps in combination with either:
o a. caps that are not seated on the nipples or
o b. nipples that are not properly fastened (it makes them longer, same as a).
* if you ignore the other points and depend on greased chambers to prevent any chainfire.

There's a lot more there than just cap related issues. I added the part about a deformed chamber, e.g. a chamber that just isn't round when it should be. I'd also be interested in hearing more about the particular firearm that Hawg experiences chain fire. I wonder what type of revolver it is, who made it, the ball size and if it is cast or swagged, and any rust or deformities it has in the chambers. Somehow, fire is getting past the lead ball.
 
I use a 50/50 mixture of beeswax (toilet ring, a cheap man's version) and Parafin wax with a little olive oil to keep it soft. And in the summer it hasn't ran down my legs, uet. It does get soft on those really hot days. And I will admit they want to stick together in my little baggie. But for overall use, it has been good for me and a lot cheaper than the wonder wads. But it is a personal preference.
Click to expand...

I use the T rings for my grease cookie also, in fact I need to make a batch up. My next batch I'm going to make thinner, see how thin I can go before they become to hard to handle.
 
ClemBert, it's a Rigarmi 58 Remington Beals made in 69. I bought it new. It takes #9 caps and all I could find were 11's. Pretty sloppy fit even pinched. I use 10's on it now, much better fit but still have to be pinched down pretty good. I was 12 when I bought it and knew nothing at all about bp. Neither did the shop owner that sold it to me. I learned everything on my own. I had chain fire after chain fire until I tried putting a drop of 3n1 oil over the balls(I know now but didn't then:D). Chambers are not pitted and measure a fairly uniform .452 with a .001-.002 difference here and there but none larger than .452. I can(and have) load all six and grease the balls and only install one cap at a time. Fire all six without a chain fire. I can load all six and not grease the balls, install all the caps and it'll fire anywhere from two to all six every time.
As for being ugly, yes it is. I used this gun almost every day when I was a kid and it's been dropped, thrown, submerged in a river, gone through a flood and rode around in the back of a pick up truck. The only damage the gun ever suffered was a broken loading lever but the original lasted for years and the hand wore down enough to get it out of time. I replaced the lever and hand but it looked funny with a new blue lever so I defarbed it and rusted it up some to make it look antiquish. BTW, it's still my most accurate shooter once you learn how low to hold.

100_0286.jpg
 
Hawg, that ain't fair. You purposely rusted your piece. That has to violate some rule somewhere in the Ugly Gun Contest.:D

Have to admit that I enjoyed your story. And for a 12 year old, you were pretty handy with a micrometer. Not sure at 12 I knew what one was.:D I know you probably measured it since then.

But you may have me on the ugly gun. But I am not so sure. You might have passed ugly and be on the verge of unique.

Maybe I should take the ROA and remove the bluing and see what I get. I am afraid it would probably resemble something akin to a plucked turkey.

Thanks big shooter.
 
I knew what a micrometer was at 12 cuz I worked in my dads shop building engines but I never thought about measuring chambers or bores till relatively recently. It had some rust on it, even a few light external pits. I just wanted to make everything match but I didn't want to reblue it. I have been thinking about doing electrolysis on it. That would give it a dark gray patina that I think would look pretty good.
 
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