5 most important handguns

S

SPUSCG

New member
Im thinking:

Colt Patterson: The first revovler, started the trend to better wheelguns. Got us from break opens to repeaters.

Volcanic Repeater: Desighn was one of first repeating guns, legitamized cartridged ammo back when it was all about black powder, Smith and Weson met on this project and formed their partnership, invented the .22lr, the worlds most popular cartridge.

Mauser c96-
First successful semiautomatic, legitamized its role as a military weapon

Walther p38:
First successful da/sa military weapon, Led to more guns using this back in the day of SAO.

1911:
One of the most popular guns of all time, many features have been incorporated into other desighns, and it is popular in military, LE, and competition/ civilain use also. They are THE american gun.

What do you think?
 
I disagree with a few things

Got us from break opens to repeaters.
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Not exactly. It got us from single shots, which were muzzle loaders, to repeaters.

invented the .22lr, the worlds most popular cartridge.
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Again, not exactly. They came up with the 22 short black powder. The bigger merit to that is not the popularity, but that it was first practical self contained cartridge which was simultaneously chambered in a successful handgun.

Mauser c96-
First successful semiautomatic, legitamized its role as a military weapon

Walther p38:
First successful da/sa military weapon, Led to more guns using this back in the day of SAO.
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Those were important designs but I would say the luger, esp the P08 was more influential than either. The C96 was not a 9mm until Luger himself invented the 9mm and the P38 was revolutionary, but not in the same way as the luger. As far as the C96 being the first successful semi auto, definte "first successful" because I would instead give that title to the C93 aka Borchardt.

Aside from the peacemaker aka SAA being missing, the Colt 1889 was big leap forward bringing together the swing out cylinder and the DA trigger.

whatever the first polymer gun should be up there too, changed the whole game..
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I think it was the H&K VP 70. It was before the glock, I know that much.
 
I was gonna say it was the VP, but I wasn't 100%. I've heard the trigger pull wasn't kind.

Was the hi-power the first hi cap 9mm? If so that was pretty revolutionary as well.
 
From people who owned the VP70 they say the trigger was heavy and craptastic. If Glock didn't come out with the G17 and single handedly changed the way the public and the industry thought of polymer frames the polymer framed pistol might have died with the VP70. The same way HK experimented with caseless ammunition. And that too died as a novelty. How much can be said for pistol that wasnt' even liked by their owners? Could polymer guns come into the mainstream without Glock? Possibly, but I don't like dealing with revisionist alternate history.

My Top 5 no particular order:

Patterson Colt Revolver
Colt 1911
Luger P08
S&W M&P Model 10 (Hand Ejector)
Glock 17

*Colt SAA, S&W 27 Registered Magnum (.357 magnum), Walther P38, BHP, S&W 36 (J frame) round out the top 10 for their influence and historical importance.
 
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Regarding the SAA:

It really wasn't that big a breakthrough! Seriously. Remington's 1858 percussion gun was basically similar in a lot of ways, except that the S&W patent on the through-bored cylinder hadn't run out yet (not until 1872). Once that patent ran out, something like the SAA was absolutely inevitable. The only real surprise was that the Remington 1875 near-equivelent to the SAA didn't ship earlier, a major blooper on Remmy's part.

One gun not mentioned yet is the first S&W in 44Russian, which pioneered the idea of backing the bullet deeper into an oversize shell, leading the way to every cartridge we use save the 22LR/22Short family - the only surviving "heeled bullet" designs. And the 44Russian cartridge wasn't designed in the US, it was actually specified by the Russian buyers of the first batch from S&W.
 
VP-70 was not crap. It did have a rather heavy trigger, but it was completely functional and trigger was direct pull. Sights were "different" but they worked. Magazine was easy to load and gun was comfortable in the hand.
1) Patterson (first successful bored-through cylinder revolver)
2) P-08 (single action, successful auto)
3) P-38 (SA/DA, successful auto)
4) First DA revolver with drop-down cylinder
5) T/C Contender (Changed the whole conception of what a handgun cartridge was)
Designs chosen should not be derivative from prior guns. 1911 should be on if it was the first locked breech, short recoil gun. P-35 should not be on as it is little more than derivative from 1911. P-08 can be derivative of Borshard (sp-whatever the spelling was)
 
Is this limited to repeating handguns?

There should be mention of the Chinese inventor who figured out one could make a small canon and fire it one handed. (Not to mention private 13th class Chang, who tested the first successful handgun of any sort. With a moment of silence for the six or seven prior privates who tested unsuccessful designs.)

Surely, the early Colt revolver was a milestone in design. But it would not be possible without the prior development of the single shot percussion pistol. Would it have been made without the pepperbox pistol?

I'm not sure I can limit the number of 'significant' handguns to just five. For instance, the S&W model 39 was the first commercially successful 9x19 AND the first commercially successful DA/SA autopistol made in the United States. What about the S&W Military and Police .38 Special? It's a cornerstone of handgun design and development. There's the Iver Johnson "Owl's Head" revolver and the like; they made self-defense affordable to millions of people.

The development of the modern handgun has followed many of the same steps as rifles and shotguns. Ignition systems from touch-hole to matchlock to wheel-lock to flint to percussion to cartridge. All of those developments had to have a first model.

Also consider a global view of history. The Basque made 'Ruby' group of .32 ACP pistols from the time of the First World War armed multitudes of soldiers in conflict well into the Second World War. The Ruby had many faults, but were affordable and usually fired when needed. A great example of sub-letting production of firearms. There were many developments leading to modern firearms that did not occur in the western world. Some, not even in modern times.

But it's an interesting question nonetheless. Looking back and taking stock of 'how did we get here?' is always enlightening.
 
The only real surprise was that the Remington 1875 near-equivelent to the SAA didn't ship earlier, a major blooper on Remmy's part.
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From what I have read,,,
It wasn't a blooper on Remington's part,,,
It was the fact that Sam Colt tied them up in lawsuits.

One of Colt's strategies was to sue anyone who made anything that threatened his market dominance,,,
He delayed the Remington's appearance just long enough for the Army to opt for the SAA.

At least that's what I have read.

Aarond
 
I agree that the Browning High Power should make it to top 5 most important handgun designs.

My list would be Colt 1911, Browning High Power, Walther P38, Walther pp/k, Ruger 22.

Those are the pistols i think are the greatest. Honourable mention to the Luger P08
 
VP-70 was not crap. It did have a rather heavy trigger, but it was completely functional and trigger was direct pull.
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I described (actually an owner of a VP70) the VP70's trigger as craptastic. I never said the pistol wasn't "functional". It was the first but the shooting public and the firearm industry (including H&K) has aggresively moved into the polymer frame pistol market not because of the VP70, but the Glock 17.

Being the first to do something counts for something. But what matters more is that it has to actually change our shooting habits and the industry. The pistol actually has to change the way people think and embrace the concept into mainstream firearms culture. The VP70 did none of that. It "worked" but that was the extent of its influence. It was Glock that single handedly broke down all the barriers and misconceptions about a polymer pistol. Today Glocks influence is seen in other ways, like the way other companies have embraced a design with a simple user interface (M&P, XD, and Kahr).
 
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In line with your Subject title; I am going to nominate the Beretta M9 Service Pistol. It is the most important since it is the handgun currently supporting our troops in combat.

Just like the M1911 was the most important in its era, the M9 is now.

If you or someone else wants to change it to best, most liked, or some other category of discussion; well then maybe we can quibble some.
 
How bad was the H&K VP70z?

It was soooo bad, even having James Bond carry one in one of the John Gardner stories couldn't sell them to Mall Ninjas.

The redeeming feature of the pistol was it could be a submachinegun with the proper buttstock. As a regular handgun, it was - poor. From a technical development standpoint, it was one of the very early plastic guns, had very few moving parts and should have been cheap to make.

I place the VP70z in a category analogous to the Yugo in automobiles: Interesting, but I don't care to own or drive one.
 
5 most important handguns[/QUOTE

Very hard to argue with the logic, but I would like to add one more if I may. The Smith and Wesson 38/44 H.D. This was the platform used to develop what would become the .357 Magnum then the .41 and .44 Magnum rounds.
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