458 socom
- Thread starter sfwusc
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Ike Clanton
New member
I’ve seen people posting 33 grains of h-110 with a 325 ftx so I think you’re good. I’m about to start some loads with cfe blk and the 325 ftx
If you can't find PUBLISHED data from a recognized source that does pressure testing and load evaluation, then you are entirely on your own, and I recommend not using data just because anonymous people post it on the internet.
I may give you my loads for some cartridges, but you'll find those loads in the books if you look.
People post all kinds of cra...er...information on the internet. Some of it isn't true or trustworthy.
I may give you my loads for some cartridges, but you'll find those loads in the books if you look.
People post all kinds of cra...er...information on the internet. Some of it isn't true or trustworthy.
My sierra app has data for a 300g sjhp with h110 start 31.1g, max 35.2g
As stated, I would neve just use a load I found online without finding that load, or at leas something real close, in a manual.
You are correct to some degree metal god, but there is data to be had.
speer, no data
hornady, no data
lyman, 5 loads
Hogdon, many loads, none with h110
lee, 20 loads, none with h110
sierra, only 1 bullet, but but about 20 powders including h110
As stated, I would neve just use a load I found online without finding that load, or at leas something real close, in a manual.
You are correct to some degree metal god, but there is data to be had.
speer, no data
hornady, no data
lyman, 5 loads
Hogdon, many loads, none with h110
lee, 20 loads, none with h110
sierra, only 1 bullet, but but about 20 powders including h110
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Yep that's where I'd start but based on internet data I'd be hesitant to load up a bunch that low . I'm concerned the action may not cycle at that charge . Lyman used a 18" barrel but does not say what gas system . My guess is carbine but it could be rifle length . These specialty AR cartridges need to be matched with the right gas length , gas port size and burn rate to be optimized .
I see a lot of internet data that says 28gr to 32-ish grains but they all have the same max velocity in the mid 1600's fps which leads me to believe although I see that data in multiple locations . It's all likely based off of one source because none of my manuals have the same max charge and velocities as another manual for any cartridge . Yet this 458 cartridge has the same exact data everywhere except in a actual manual where it's quite different .
My point is still the same and that is the Lyman data using a 18" barrel would lead me to believe at minimum they have/had a long dwell time of at least 8" if not 11" . I'd only load up a 2 or 3 at each charge increment the first time out just to see if your upper will cycle those charges . I hate coming home and having to pull/break down cartridges that did not work .
My main concern is that the case fill is below 70% with a powder that is known to have occasional squib-out issues in straight-wall cases when used at less than 88% fill. It may be the shoulder and length of the case are enough to lower the expansion rate enough that it isn't the problem it can be in revolver cartridges. There certainly is no barrel/cylinder gap dropping pressure. But I would just keep an extra careful eye out that if anything sounds or feels off, you check that light still shows down the barrel. Having one of the cartridge-shaped laser bore sighters you can pop into the chamber for a quick check is probably the most convenient thing to use at the range.
26 grains, at just over 50% case fill is on the cusp of volume that can cause erratic pressure and velocity. I would have the chronograph out when testing to check for this. It is also, according to interior ballistics software (both QL and GRT), going to operate at around 17,000 psi, which is low enough for this powder to be quite dirty burning, so you may want to look for unburned powder after your first shot.
There is no pressure test data in Lyman because they were shooting through a production firearm. I note they stop at 28 grains, presumably because they think they spotted a pressure sign. Both interior ballistics software packages think the velocities reported by Lyman are reasonable, but the pressure they project is just under 2/3 of what the cartridge is rated for. So, again, look for dirty burning.
26 grains, at just over 50% case fill is on the cusp of volume that can cause erratic pressure and velocity. I would have the chronograph out when testing to check for this. It is also, according to interior ballistics software (both QL and GRT), going to operate at around 17,000 psi, which is low enough for this powder to be quite dirty burning, so you may want to look for unburned powder after your first shot.
There is no pressure test data in Lyman because they were shooting through a production firearm. I note they stop at 28 grains, presumably because they think they spotted a pressure sign. Both interior ballistics software packages think the velocities reported by Lyman are reasonable, but the pressure they project is just under 2/3 of what the cartridge is rated for. So, again, look for dirty burning.
FrankenMauser
New member
I agree with Unclenick, and ran into the same issue with some loads in .458 SOCOM. What feels like a "safe" starting load for H110/W296 doesn't take up enough case volume and may create its own issues.
I use H110 for subs in .300 Blk, but gave up on it for .458 SOCOM.
CAUTION: The following post (or a page linked to) includes or discusses loading data not covered by currently published sources of tested data for this cartridge (QuickLOAD or Gordon's Reloading Tool data is not professionally tested). USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assumes any liability for any damage or injury resulting from the use of this information.
If you are okay with a powder that puts more heat into the chamber, Lil Gun is a reasonable option. 32 gr has been established as the real world max with a 325 FTX seated to the cannelure and a magnum pistol primer or standard rifle primer (if your brass has rifle primer pockets). My rifle needed two charges, however, because it was temperature sensitive. I ended up around 28.5 gr, and had a load about 1.5 gr lighter for use in the summer.
I strongly recommend getting your hands on some SBR-SOCOM, though. Best powder I have found for the cartridge.
A close substitute is another variant of the parent powder, A1680.
And it is far better than the QL load data that is so commonly used, even though QL doesn't know what to do with the cartridge and spits out wildly optimistic max charges. The QL data that is commonly shared is generally over actual max by 15-20%.
I use H110 for subs in .300 Blk, but gave up on it for .458 SOCOM.
CAUTION: The following post (or a page linked to) includes or discusses loading data not covered by currently published sources of tested data for this cartridge (QuickLOAD or Gordon's Reloading Tool data is not professionally tested). USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assumes any liability for any damage or injury resulting from the use of this information.
If you are okay with a powder that puts more heat into the chamber, Lil Gun is a reasonable option. 32 gr has been established as the real world max with a 325 FTX seated to the cannelure and a magnum pistol primer or standard rifle primer (if your brass has rifle primer pockets). My rifle needed two charges, however, because it was temperature sensitive. I ended up around 28.5 gr, and had a load about 1.5 gr lighter for use in the summer.
I strongly recommend getting your hands on some SBR-SOCOM, though. Best powder I have found for the cartridge.
A close substitute is another variant of the parent powder, A1680.
I generally agree. But the 458socomforums.com - specifically that forum - has better real world load data than even some of the published "trusted" sources.
And it is far better than the QL load data that is so commonly used, even though QL doesn't know what to do with the cartridge and spits out wildly optimistic max charges. The QL data that is commonly shared is generally over actual max by 15-20%.
Unclenick brings up a very good point . Lyman brings up this issue in the manual when loading the 500gr subsonic loads . They caution to be sure your rounds are making impact down range after each shot to be sure you don't squib a round . They don't say to do this with any other bullet or charge weight but think as UN pointed out when using H-110 you should keep an eye out . At first , I recommend only loading one round in a mag at a time and firing making sure the bullet exits the barrel each time .
FWIW Lyman used Mag primers in all there loads , I don't load the cartridge so I'm not sure if that's SOP
FWIW Lyman used Mag primers in all there loads , I don't load the cartridge so I'm not sure if that's SOP
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FrankenMauser
New member
I forgot to mention previously:
Part of the reason why the 458socomforums data is superior to other "unpublished" sources, is because most of the popular loads have actually been pressure tested by a couple members there, if not by SBR Ammunition. Not just using their Oehler equipment, but actual lab testing.
The QL data is dangerous, like most of the other loads on the interwebs. But the verified loads on that forum are good.
Part of the reason why the 458socomforums data is superior to other "unpublished" sources, is because most of the popular loads have actually been pressure tested by a couple members there, if not by SBR Ammunition. Not just using their Oehler equipment, but actual lab testing.
The QL data is dangerous, like most of the other loads on the interwebs. But the verified loads on that forum are good.
Unkl Chuck
New member
Western's Handloading Guide, Edition 1 gives several loads for their powders with pressures in the 34,000psi range. Not H110, but a 'reliable source' for some Accurate powders and Ramshot Enforcer. I believe that most of their data is available online as well.
As others have recommended, I would recommend 458socomforums.com.
Stay safe.
As others have recommended, I would recommend 458socomforums.com.
Stay safe.
Unkl Chuck
New member
Thanks, Unclenick, I've lurked for years, but never posted. The Western manual was handy in the library and 'fairly current'. Had forgotten about Hodgdon taking over Western's distribution of Western.
The 458socomsforums has been my best source of 458 information. Have one, but shoot it little and handload for it little. Prefer my Striker and other pistols.
Stay safe.
The 458socomsforums has been my best source of 458 information. Have one, but shoot it little and handload for it little. Prefer my Striker and other pistols.
Stay safe.