.45 LC for Black Powder Cartridges

D

Doc Hoy

New member
I cast my own bullets and use BHN 12 - 14 for .45 LC. I started out using .452LRN from a Lee mold. It was .452 x 200.

I had a good bit of leading and moved to a larger bullet to reduce leading. So now I am up to a .456 which is sized down to .454 in a Lyman Lube Sizer. I am using Bees wax and mutton tallow for a lube. The .456 bullet also comes from a Lee mold and is also BHN 12 - 14 (.456 x 228 LRN).

This bullet seems to work pretty good. It makes my 1873 WInchester clone a tack driver. I have no problems accept when I use R-P brass.

When I use the Remington brass the bullet gets slightly larger at the mouth and fails the plunk test in my revolvers, all of my revolvers. Works okay in the two lever guns.

It appears that the R-P brass is thicker at the mouth. It is only by one or two thousandths, but I suppose that is enough.

Am I the only one who loads .45LC who doesn't know about R-P brass?
 
Guess I have never noticed in my revolvers ... whatever brass I use. Mostly Starline, but I do have boxes of 'mixed' stuff. Of course all my bullets are sized .452.... Even my BP .45 Colt cartridges. I only shoot BP cartridges in my .45 Colt original Vaquero which has had the throats reamed to .4525. My other revolvers get smokeless loads which shouldn't (doesn't) make a hill of beans difference.
 
Thanks R.

Now that yo mention it, the leading problem was not apparent in the revolvers. Only the rifles.

Maybe I have a non problem.
 
Do the rounds chamber with a little pressure? To be honest I've never really used the plunk test for a revolver, only a semi-auto. Since the rifling does not start in the cylinder, all a bullet really needs to do is fit in the throat. The tighter the better really, so for the revolver I don't mind at all if I have to give them a little push to fully seat - as long as they chamber without undue force I consider them good. I have tried loading some old balloon head.45 Colt brass (with BP) that was expanded just a little too much above the rim to chamber without excessive force. But if the loaded cartridge will slip in the chamber with a little thumb pressure I'll shoot em.
 
Same thing here in .44-40.
If I load the .428-.429" bullets my groove diameters want, RP brass is tight or won't chamber at all. WW will. Starline with .428" only.
 
Am I the only one who loads .45LC who doesn't know about R-P brass?
Click to expand...

I know about R-P brass, been using it for decades in .45 colt and it works great, for me, anyway.

My 250gr loads drop into the chamber. No drag, no need to push, or shove to fully seat. If yours doesn't I would assume you are doing something differently than I do. (not saying "wrong", but my opinion, if the rounds don't "plunk" something's not quite right).

I shoot R-P, Win, FC and starline in .45 Colt, still using brass I first fired in 83, when its turn to be reloaded comes up.
 
Three responses....

Ifishsum,

When I say "plunk test" I mean dropping the rounds into the chamber of the revolver cylinder. Sort of using the cylinder as a test gauge. Problem is...When I load R-P with .454s they start to interfere at about two thirds of the way into the chamber. I can get some of them to go home with a little pressure but I don't overdo it. Chambering them in the rifle is no problem and it may be that the lever applies enough force to get them to chamber without my realizing it. I did not try just dropping them into the breach but I will. I will begin using the R-P rounds for the rifles only.

JW,

Agree and not to be redundant but I use WW, Aquila, FC, Winchester Starline, all fine. I will admit that I do not generlly sort them out, but I am going to start.

44Amp,

Yes...I agree that something is wrong and it may just be that R-P brass with a slightly increased thickness cause problems with the bigger diameter bullets. When I measured them I got thickness that ran about one to two thousandths larger than every other headstamp. The ones that were at the lower end (closer in thickness to Winchester which I used as a standard since they all were thinner and since that is what I have most of) would chamber properly. No drag at all. But I only found one or two of those in problem two dozen R-Ps.

I have probly a thousand rounds of .45LC brass left to load and probly 500 already loaded. Looks like I have some sorting to do.

So my last question was sort of answered:

I asked if I was the only one who didn't know about this situation with R-P brass. JW commented not only about .45LC but also .44-40 needing a little additional attention as to bullet size. 44AMP reports no issue. This is good stuff.

The reason I am concerned that I am the only one who doesn't know something is that I am a very solitary shooter. The only folks I actually talk to about loading is your guys on this forum.
 
It would if....

......the die will also squeeze down the diameter of the case for the last quarter of an inch.

I can look at the rounds and tell if they are going to fit in the revolver just by examining the last quarter inch. I can see the part of the caes which is larger. In some cases I can see the lube rings of the bullet showing through the enlargement of the case. I compare it with a Winchester case round made just previously or just after the R-P case and can tell the difference very easily. Bullets are the same. Dies and press are the same. Adjustment of the seating die is the same.

So running all of the rounds through a factory crimp die as a final step might correct the problem.
 
Thanks, Doc

A little more information (which I forgot to put in my reply),

I load for Ruger Blackhawks, & Vaqueros, and a .45 Colt barrel Contender.

and these days, I use the Oregon trail lasercast slugs which are ~.452"

That you are using .454" and different guns might be the difference.
 
Load .45 LC for....

The Vaquero and Uberti Cattleman, Taylor's Smokewagon, A Taylors Stainless Steel Cattleman a Rossi 92 Winchester and the 1873 Winchester from Uberti...

I find the chambers are ever so slightly tighter on the Vaquero than the Ubertis. Some of the round that won't go into the Vaquero slide into the Ubertis with just a little yutzing.

When I measure these slugs they are running consistently .454.
 
Sawdustdad

I have heard of the Posse but never visited or shot with them.

Don't know who the Missouri Marshall is.

I probly should go if there are meetings.
 
Doc Hoy,
I assumed you were a SASS/CAS shooter from the guns you listed. Pungo Posse is a SASS club that shoots in Waverly, VA. Missouri Marshal lives in VA Beach. and comes up this way for various matches. I'm near Richmond and shoot with clubs in the area but haven't been down to Pungo yet--planning to go to their two day match oct 24/25. Just wondering 'cause of the topic.
 
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