.38 vs. 9mm

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Doug.38PR

Moderator
Okay, I'm a little new to guns. What exactly is the difference between 9mm and .38 special (regular)

What are the tradeoffs between the two in terms of the bullets, catridges, and types of guns (autos 9mm vs. revolvers .38)
Yes there are obvious differences such as the high capacity of 9mm auto and the simplicity of .38 special but what are the differences in stopping power. Which is the prefered. What are the tradeoffs?

Doug
 
Go to the gun store and look at the loads. I learn a lot doing that and enjoy it as well. The .38 is about twice as long as the 9mm and twice as expensive to buy rounds.
 
I will post both calibers below with some information about each. I hope it helps.

9mm
- Chambered in Auto pistols and Revolvers (S&W 940)
- Common caliber, very popular, inexpensive target ammunition.
- Plethora of pistols in this caliber, from inexpensive military imports to highly customized competition pistols
- Large variety of self defense loadings
- Low recoil in most handguns
- Lighter bullet loadings, 115 grain bullet weight standard.

.38 Special
- Chambered in Revolvers (with one exception Model 52 S&W Auto, Wadcutters only)
- Common caliber, very popular, a little more expensive than 9mm ammo
- Plethora of revolvers in this caliber, all price ranges
- Durable and dependable
- Large variety of self defense loadings
- Low recoil in most handguns
- Heavier bullet loadings,158 grain bullet weight standard.

If you want to see some ballistics look around the internet. Check some of the ammunition manufacturers sites and some of the reloading data sites. These will give you some ideas of what each caliber is capable of. It would take too long to type all that out here. Sorry.. but Good luck.

.44mag
 
It's worth noting that 9mm,.38 and .357 are all the same size projectiles (near as dammit anyhow). The difference is in the driving force and that (mostly) depends on the case size. Normally power goes up from 9mm to .38 to .357. Stopping power is quite another thing. Firstly it depends on what you are trying to stop. A human sized animal can be stopped by any one of them provided you are using a JHP Factory Load. I don't think there is much difference between the 9mm and the .38. The .357 is another thing altogether. Full power .357 will go clean through a human sized animal most of the time and need to be used with that in mind.
 
The 9mm is much more powerful than a .38 special, the .38 special +P would be closer in power, but not equal to a properly loaded 9mm. the .38 is a great target round, and is used alot, but is rather anemic as a defensive round. It is more close in stopping power to the .380 auto. Some 9mm's loaded hot will approach , but not equal the .357 mag.
 
What Ron H said..kinda.(only reason it's - kinda - is because between the .357 and the +P .38 spl, I'd take the .38 any day of the week. Personally, I have little to no use for the .357Magnum. - great as it is.)

I'll add this too. Depending on the 2 platforms, the 9mm can have a distinct advantage over the .357Magnum.

A 124 gr 9mm Plus P out of a full sized gun like a High Power is far more civilized than a 125 gr .357 out of a snub nose K frame Smith, like a 2 1/2 inch model 66.

A Remington Gloden Saber 125 gr .357 has a listed velcoity of 1220 fps out of a 4" vented test barrel.
A Remington Golden Saber 124 gr 9mm +P has a listed velocity of 1180 fps out of a 4" test barrel.
A Remington Golden Saber 124 gr 9mm standard pressure has a listed velocity of 1125 fps out of a 4" test barrel.

I'd bet money that the .357 out of a snubbie is pretty close to what the standard pressure 9mm round is. If it isn't then the +P certainly is....if not more.
In controlabilty, it's a no contest. The .357 snub nose was (is) a handfull with 6 rounds. OTOH, the High Power using standard GS is a pussycat. Even +P offerings don't approach the blast of the .357 out of a short barrel.

I use the K frame snubbie and the High Power as examples because they are virtually the same size. The day I shot both and had them on the table for cleaning, and noticed that when I lay 66 on top of the High Power, they were the same size,,,,is the day the 66 went in for a trade.
 
One of the biggest drawbacks to the .38spcl is platform.

Just not many choices there, while the 9mm has almost unlimited options.

Another problem with the .38spcl is that it is old technology

The mfg's have simply not put their development money into the .38

Because of the interest in Backup Guns, there are a couple new loads out, but they still lag behind the 9mm
 
Speed (vs) Energy...........?

Sorta a generaliztion here: 9mm seems to be (general) cheapest to shoot
38 Special about next
38+P
357 most.........

Now again I say in general.....

Remington is just one maker of all four above. They have an outstanding line-up and good ballistics info on their web site pages. I think the numbers can help you out with that part. As for which is better.........ha you have opened a can of worms.......everyone has an idea of what is best for them. To put it simple.....I wouldn't want to be on the wrong end of the barrel from any of the 4. This includes wad cutters right up to Jacket Hollow Points.......

At present I trust my safety to 115g JHP from Winchester in my 9mm...

The numbers I look at when thinking ballistics are muzzle velocity - and muzzle energy. I seem to put a little more importance on the energy than the speed (velocity) but both are important. The way I sum it up is would I want to be hit by a fast sports car (light weight) or hit slower and harder by a Hummer2 ? Well, neither sounds like fun but if for some stange reason I could pick..........hmmmmm or maybe the boxer idea........would I rather get knocked out by a feather weight with some fast hands or get knocked out by a heavy weight with slow and powerful mits......... all in all at close range combat distance will it matter......and to all the garble above YES it matters and more than likely the 357 is putting both speed and energy together to give you the best of both worlds.........

I like the 9mm for the economy priced ammo for practice........ It's lighter recoil than the 357 is also more user friendly.........but if I had to pick 1 round and say it was the all out best.........for personal defense I would have to give the Magnum the win...........my next gun is going to be a S&W snub noser in 357. NOW- remember this is just one silly guys view point...... :D

PS........ Cor-bon makes some factory ammo that shows some nice ballistics on paper......might be trying some of this diet soon.......?
 
Uh oh, the moon is out again.

First let's talk about old technology. The 9x19 and the .38 special were both introduced in 1902, that's over a hundred years ago, should we go by months to see which is older technology? An apparent lack of information is to blame here. The 1908 Luger pistol, a very complex, yet technically astounding semi auto pistol was the first to chamber the 9x19 as a production caliber, ergo the caliber's surname 9mm Luger.

One of the biggest drawbacks to the .38spcl is platform.
Click to expand...

I would assume you mean the fact that the .38 special is mainly loaded into revolvers. I say mainly because the S&W model 52 Auto was a .38 special, albiet wadcutters only. Please clarify for us in the REVOLVER forum.

Just not many choices there, while the 9mm has almost unlimited options.
Click to expand...

Again by saying there are not many choices, I conclude that you mean there are no combat automatics out in .38 special. If that is your point, then yes, the choices are narrower in that regards, but there are many, many revolvers chambered for .38, at least as many as there are pistols chambered in 9mm Luger.

The mfg's have simply not put their development money into the .38

Because of the interest in Backup Guns, there are a couple new loads out, but they still lag behind the 9mm
Click to expand...

Oh boy.... Let's count the number of loads out for the .38 special and the 9mm from the major manufacturers (Remington, Winchester, Federal, Speer-CCI, and PMC)

9mm - 51 total loads available from the above listed companies.

38 special - 46 total loads available from the above listed companies.

* Numbers taken from each companies website and added for total.

I don't see a big difference in development or commitment here, especially for two cartridges that started life in the same year over 100 years ago.

Just had to correct some crazy notions here.. sorry for my rant. I think both calibers are effective in the packages they come in. The .38 is more accurate, and the 9mm is slightly more powerful.

As for the comment that the 9mm is approaching .357 magnum ballistics, well, some time with a reloading manual and a ballistics chart should cure that notion. Good luck.

.44mag
 
Out of short barrels (2" snubs) the 357 mag factory loadings generally only get 100-150 fps more velocity than 9mm out of 3" barrels, but this added velocity comes at a cost in terms of muzzle blast and recoil. Thus, the 9mm is probably easier to employ than the 357 mag snub for most self-defense uses, without giving up much in energy or power factors. Each shooter needs to determine which platform (357 snub vs. micro 9mm) is best for him/her.
 
I usually don't generalize but will in this case. The .38 will do anything the 9mm will and is more versatile. I am commenting on the CARTRIDGES only. What it comes down to is simply revolver vs. auto, nothing more, nothing less. Decide what you prefer. There is not a wrong choice.
 
Hit in the right spot and you will never notice the difference between the two with whatever bullet you use. Place your shots and don't worry about the rest. But seeing how you might be shooting for your life and have to shoot through forearms, heavy clothing, and no telling what else I would be leary of any bullet less than 150grs. Light bullets lose penetration energy much earlier, especially when expanding. Expanding in a forearm, which is pretty common, then having a 115-124gr. bullet, which as already used up a lot of it's energy in exansion, then have to penetrate to the vitals is risky business. Light bullets don't handle bone as well either. Stick a septum into a gelatin block and your results will change drastically. A lot of times it will do fine, but then you have angles to worry about.
 
Speaking of the Remington site:

From www.remington.com
.38 Special purpose designed fighting hollowpoint
Index No. Cartridge Type Wt. (grs) Bullet Style Primer No. B.L.*
GS38SB Golden Saber™ 125 Brass-Jacketed Hollow Point +P ‡ 1 1/2 4"
Cartridge Type Bullet Velocity Muzzle 50 100
Golden Saber™ 125 BJHP +P 975 929 885
Cartridge Type Bullet Energy Muzzle 50 100
Golden Saber™ 125 BJHP +P 264 238 218

9mm purpose designed fighting hollowpoint
Index No. Cartridge Type Wt. (grs) Bullet Style Primer No. B.L.*
GS9MMD Golden Saber™ 124 Brass-Jacketed Hollow Point +P ‡ 1 1/2 4"
Cartridge Type Bullet Velocity Muzzle 50 100
Golden Saber™ 124 BJHP +P 1180 1089 1021
Cartridge Type Bullet Energy Muzzle 50 100
Golden Saber™ 124 BJHP +P 384 327 287

Interesting comparison, I stand amazed. 50% more energy at the barrel for the 9mm +P

Geoff
Whose mind boggles. :eek:
 
PaleRyder,

The best I have seen on new (not remanufactured) .38 special is $8.99 bought in single boxes. I've seen new 9mm for $4.99 or $5.99 a box. They aren't the same quality but I've seen cheaper stuff for the 9mm. What price did you see at your gun shop for each? The are both about to becaome close to the same for me because I'm getting a reloading kit this weekend.
 
I may have missed it, but did someone show or reference % knockdown capability for these? I've heard the 125 gr jhp .38 is quite good as a self defense load. As for me .40 S&W all the way :) in an autoloader. Otherwise I have a .38 Taurus wheelgun (with aforementioned 125 gr) for reliable house defense (no "thinking" (is the safety on or off, etc.), no jamming, just point n shoot) and a .44 Mag (loaded with pretty nice self defense .44 Sp load when in the house) SA Ruger as "backup" (main function: hunter, camp gun in bear/mountain lion country, etc.)
 
What seb5 said.

I would only add that a hotly loaded 9x19 will better penetrate hard barriers or materials.
 
I have a .357 snub, and a 4.5" 9mm auto. Shooting .357 out of a snub, is like shooting a loud flamethrower. It's brutally loud and violent. Next comes the 38spl, then the 9mm. In my mind, the 38 and 9mm are about the same. If you look at the ballistics, the 9mm has more muzzle velocity, but maybe this comes from the longer barrel and less leakage than the revolver. Maybe someone out there has a 9mm revolver. That would probably be the best way to compare the two calibers in a similar platform. :cool:
 
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