.38 Spl Revover, S&W?

A

Anibal

New member
I found this revolver and I need help to indentify it.
It looks like a model 10 skiny barrel, on the right side of the frame has the sign of Smith and Wesson with the letters S W and the sleeves whith the words "TRADE MARK", on the same right side of the frame below the cylinder is witten "MADE IN USA", on the right side of the barrel says ".38 LONG", on the left side of the barrel says ".38 SPECIAL CTG", and the top of the barrel is written "MANUFACTERED BY RUBY ARMS COMPANY PATENTED" "OCT.8.20 DEC.9.20 FEB.5.20 SEP.18.24" "ACEROS DE ALTA RESISTENCIA" (it means: High endurance steel in spanish), the number inside the yoke is 531XCX and the number on the bottom of the butt is 324XX.
Is it a actual S&W revolver? or is it a copy under license? or is it a ilegal copy of a S&W revolver?.

Anibal.
 
Is it a actual S&W revolver? or is it a copy under license? or is it a ilegal copy of a S&W revolver?
Click to expand...

No, no, and yes. It's a thousand wonders Smith managed to get any revolvers made during the late 19th and early 20th Centuries, given how much time and effort they spent trying to stop their patents and trademarks from being infringed upon. :)
 
Ruby was one of several cheap copies made in Spain. Yes, they were trade infringements stealing both the S&W design and their name and markings trying to fool people into thinking they were buying an actual Smith & Wesson product. Unsafe to shoot, no collector value, sorry if you paid more than about $20 for it as a curiosity.
 
Word to the wise.

Don't shoot it.

Don't even think about putting a +P cartridge in it. It would likely come down around your ears in chunky bits.

Quality management procedures?

What the hell were those?
 
Thanks everybody for your answers and advices. Now I´m worry about this gun.
I know any old .38 spl. revolver must no use +P, but I want to know, is it unsafe even with standard pressure bullets?
Because now I know is a fake S&W I wat to sell it, but it is unsafe with standard pressure bullets I won´t have the nerve to sell it to anybody.

Anibal.
 
There were some S&W copies made in Spain, IIRC, that were designed to use black powder cartridges ONLY, and even moderate smokeless loads are a danger.

Simply put, don't fire this thing. It's not worth the risk.
 
First - It's probably chambered for black powder .38 Long Colt (Not .38 Special).
Do not fire this gun especially with modern, smokeless ammo!

Secondly, the Ruby guns were frequently made without heat treated cylinders which means even moderate .38 Special loads could turn this gun into a flying jigsaw puzzle.

Hold on to the gun. Wait for one of those idiotic "gun buyback" programs and turn it in. You might get $50 for it which is way more than it's worth.
 
From the original post, it sounds as if the gun is marked .38 Long on one side of the barrel, and .38 Spl. on the other side.

That seems to have been a fairly common marking, showing that the gun would fire either.
 
Hmmmm? Is there a possibility that the frame is a genuine S&W M&P? I remember seeing many 380-200 S&W British Lend Lease revolvers converted to 38 Special. Many euro police agencies used the 380-200 and after WWII they had them made into 38 Special. Spain used Orbea 38 Largo S&W copies for their police for decades. Ruby may have performed the 38 Special conversions. Usually this involved straight through cylinder boring and a barrel replacement from 5" to a different length would be done by Ruby. S&W didn't provide parts to competitors. Franco asseted Spanish independence by using domestic producers and products as far as possible. Remember the police issue 9MM Largo bolt action carbines? The revolver may just be a cobbled up Franco-American special.
 
DAmn, you can get just about anything answered here if you ask the right people.

I knew there was a reason I wandered around here every now and again.
 
The Spanish manufacturer "Ruby" along with others in Brasil, Portugal, et al was one of the primary reasons that modern S&W's carry the Marcas Registradas markings on the frame. Copies in the early 20th century forced S&W into foreign courts to enforce it's trademarks & patents. Even still, companies like Ruby kept making knock offs for sale in their own countries and some of these were brought into the U.S.

The Ruby revolvers are notorious for poor heat treating of their metals resulting in guns with a self-disassembly capability. I've seen just 2 examples of these guns, one of which had a barrel split from the muzzle back about 3/4 the length of the 6" tube. The other had been dropped down stairs by a BG at a robbery and the impact bent the cylinder yoke & alignment pin.
 
Now I am more cunfuse, is it a .38 special? or not?.
If it is a .38 Long, wouldn´t be safe even with low velocity full Wad Cutters .38 spl?

Anibal.
 
I suggest a Google search for the Old Western Scrounger. They have the proper 38 Largo ammunition. The prices MAY discourage you though..
 
"Copies in the early 20th century forced S&W into foreign courts to enforce it's trademarks & patents."

Bill,

S&W didn't really bother with the foreign courts route. It was generally accepted that it would have been a huge waste of money.

Where they really fought was in US courts. They sued not the manufacturers, but the importers, and won.
 
Thanks for the advice "To Far Gone". I won´t do it.
The bad thing about it is I don´t have the nerve to sell it to anybody else, because I don´t want anybody else be injured with it.
So I have to keep it as an ornament.

Anibal.
 
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