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.38 spl/.357 Mag reloading question
- Thread starter pathdoc
- Start date
Not a silly question at all. My reccomendation, find a 357 load using the same powder. Use the starting 357 load and work down till you get the performance you want. Might be between the 2.
With the extra case capacity velocities may be slightly lower than 38spl with the same load. Sd/es may also increase. Thats given using identical 38spl loads. But it should work and be safe.
Why dont you want to use 38 brass?
What powder and bullet weights are you working with
With the extra case capacity velocities may be slightly lower than 38spl with the same load. Sd/es may also increase. Thats given using identical 38spl loads. But it should work and be safe.
Why dont you want to use 38 brass?
What powder and bullet weights are you working with
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None that I've ever found, though I don't do it, I use magnum brass for magnum loads, only, and .38 brass for lighter loads.
I do this only for ease of identification, not because of any issues of strength, pressure, powder space volume or anything else.
You MIGHT find a slight measurable difference measuring the velocities shooting .38 loads in .357 brass, but you won't find a significant difference. (and by significant, I mean something that alters the performance enough so you, and your target can tell the difference without a chronograph and calculations.
Everyone knows about how the .357 brass is longer than .38 special, but few people actually bother to understand that the difference inside isn't as much as the outside.
The .357 case is 0.135" longer than the .38Special case (max lengths).
SO, most people assume that the internal space is that much different, as well. That difference would be the volume of a cylinder .379" in diameter (case diameter) and .135" tall. (approximately) Is that enough to significantly affect the volume of the powder space, and thereby significantly affect the performance of the .38 powder charge in the "larger" case???
BUT, look a little further, look at the loaded length numbers.
Max listed loaded length of the .357 and .38Spl does not differ by .135", it differs by 0.04"
SO, using the same bullet, loaded to listed max lengths, the difference in the powder space area of the two is NOT a cylinder .135" high, its a cylinder .04" high. That is considerably less, as .04 isn't even 1/3 of .135"....
Think about that...
I do this only for ease of identification, not because of any issues of strength, pressure, powder space volume or anything else.
You MIGHT find a slight measurable difference measuring the velocities shooting .38 loads in .357 brass, but you won't find a significant difference. (and by significant, I mean something that alters the performance enough so you, and your target can tell the difference without a chronograph and calculations.
Everyone knows about how the .357 brass is longer than .38 special, but few people actually bother to understand that the difference inside isn't as much as the outside.
The .357 case is 0.135" longer than the .38Special case (max lengths).
SO, most people assume that the internal space is that much different, as well. That difference would be the volume of a cylinder .379" in diameter (case diameter) and .135" tall. (approximately) Is that enough to significantly affect the volume of the powder space, and thereby significantly affect the performance of the .38 powder charge in the "larger" case???
BUT, look a little further, look at the loaded length numbers.
Max listed loaded length of the .357 and .38Spl does not differ by .135", it differs by 0.04"
SO, using the same bullet, loaded to listed max lengths, the difference in the powder space area of the two is NOT a cylinder .135" high, its a cylinder .04" high. That is considerably less, as .04 isn't even 1/3 of .135"....
Think about that...
stinkeypete
New member
My dad shot a LOT of .38 special out of his cowboy guns and he built up enough of a ring of crud at the case mouth that .357 brass stuck when inserted and he had to give each shell a push.
I used a .357 Maximum shell case, fire formed in my Contender, with a stick glued in the primer hole and the case mouth wet sanded to a crisp right angle to make a “scraping tool” that knocked that ridge right off. 357 would work fine, too.
A bit of solvent, time, and elbow grease with a brass brush would work too.
Me, I just use the brass labeled for the gun I am gonna use. I seat my wadcutters real long, too. It doesn’t matter one bit.
I used a .357 Maximum shell case, fire formed in my Contender, with a stick glued in the primer hole and the case mouth wet sanded to a crisp right angle to make a “scraping tool” that knocked that ridge right off. 357 would work fine, too.
A bit of solvent, time, and elbow grease with a brass brush would work too.
Me, I just use the brass labeled for the gun I am gonna use. I seat my wadcutters real long, too. It doesn’t matter one bit.
Generally speaking ...what will happen when using a 38 special load in a 357 case ... which has aliitle more case capacity ... results in just a little Less pressure and a few feet Less velocity ... probably 99% of the time this will be safe but the danger comes in light 38 special loads ... not enough pressure , not enough velocity ... bullet sticks in barrel .
There are a few powders that develop strange pressure spikes when the load doesn't develope enough pressure to burn correctly .
My best advice is to look at the load you wish to use and 1.) see if a similar load is listed in a load manual . 2.) Post the load , and what firearm you wish to shoot it in here and ask the experienced reloaders what they think .
The firearm you shoot the load in could make a big difference ... what shoots fine in a 2" barreled J-frame revolver may be a problem in a 20" barreled model 92 Winchester rifle ... not enough powder , pressure and velocity and the bullet gets stuck in the barrel .
The next shot and you get a problem ...the round isn't too hot ...it's underpowered .
Also you just have to know which powders don't like being light loaded and will pressure spike on you .
I've shot loads in 38 special brass in my 357 magnum revolvers for over 50 years ...simply clean the cylinders with a brass brush and solvent just like your barrel...cleaned after EVERY shooting session and you will totally avoid "ring around the chamber"
Don't be a lazy gun owner , clean them properly , no excuse not to have the cylinders clean and "ring " free .
Gary
There are a few powders that develop strange pressure spikes when the load doesn't develope enough pressure to burn correctly .
My best advice is to look at the load you wish to use and 1.) see if a similar load is listed in a load manual . 2.) Post the load , and what firearm you wish to shoot it in here and ask the experienced reloaders what they think .
The firearm you shoot the load in could make a big difference ... what shoots fine in a 2" barreled J-frame revolver may be a problem in a 20" barreled model 92 Winchester rifle ... not enough powder , pressure and velocity and the bullet gets stuck in the barrel .
The next shot and you get a problem ...the round isn't too hot ...it's underpowered .
Also you just have to know which powders don't like being light loaded and will pressure spike on you .
I've shot loads in 38 special brass in my 357 magnum revolvers for over 50 years ...simply clean the cylinders with a brass brush and solvent just like your barrel...cleaned after EVERY shooting session and you will totally avoid "ring around the chamber"
Don't be a lazy gun owner , clean them properly , no excuse not to have the cylinders clean and "ring " free .
Gary
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My dad shot a LOT of .38 special out of his cowboy guns and he built up enough of a ring of crud at the case mouth that .357 brass stuck when inserted and he had to give each shell a push.
This is why I want to use .357 brass for everything.
jetinteriorguy
New member
You can always just seat the bullet to the recommended OAL of the .38sp load your using. If you feel the need to crimp but it’s not in the bullets crimp groove try either a Lee collet crimp die (my recommendation) or a taper crimp die.
I have loaded tons of 38 Sp power level ammo in 357 mag cases.
From my experience, it takes very close to 10% more powder to get the same velocity using the same bullet and seating for the same length outside the case (in the crimp groove for example).
So just look up the book max for a 38 with your bullet weight and powder, add 10% to the powder charge and try it out.
From my experience, it takes very close to 10% more powder to get the same velocity using the same bullet and seating for the same length outside the case (in the crimp groove for example).
So just look up the book max for a 38 with your bullet weight and powder, add 10% to the powder charge and try it out.
Not a problem at all. I don't load .38 Special cartridges for use in my .357s. I just download .357 to .38 special power levels by using .38 Special load data. Gives one a 'wide' range of loads for the .357 from 600fps to 1500fps... I like to run my .357 at around 1000fps (out of 5 1/2" barrel). I see no reason to load .38s unless you actually have a .38 revolver. I only load .44 Special for example, because I have several .44 Special revolvers. Before that I just loaded down the .44 Magnum.is there any problem with using .38 spl loads, unaltered, in .357 magnum cases?
Read post #5
Gary
Yes, post #5 is a good read. All of it.
This subject has been hashed over quite a few times. The crud ring that develops in the cylinder is usually more of a problem with lead bullets because the lube is cruddy. Yes, it does clean out easy enough. But I have had times where there has been sufficient buildup in a single range session (started with clean gun - always) for it to be a nuisance. Like most, I tended to shoot my 38 ammo before my 357's.
I speak past tense because I have alleviated the problem three ways: First, I only shoot plated or jacketed ammo these days - so no lube crud. Without the lead lube crud, a lot more 38 ammo can be shot before the ring builds up. Second, I almost always shoot 357 mag ammo (cases) in my 357 mag guns - I have developed a de-tuned a load using a plated SWC that is likely above +P, but well below true magnum pressures. And third, when I want to shoot softer ammo (and I often do), I just use my 38 revolver (Model 67 K-frame).
I know not everybody has the luxury of simply shooting different guns, but it does exist as a solution. If I didn't have a 38 revolver, I'd likely work on a further de-tuned load using 357 cases. It'd probably be with Trail Boss, with its high fill rate.