38+P S&W snubby without internal lock??? Seen any

G

Gunmann

New member
Has anyone lately seen for sale a S&W +P rated Airweight, Airlite or Scandium snubbie without the INTERNAL LOCK? I checked online auctions and local gun shows to no avail.

I had one but gave it to my son and had a surprise that all the new ones had that darn lock.

Read an artice that on one range that they were shooting +P's the locks came apart in a 642 and a 44 mag and jammed the gun.

Not too cool in a carry gun!!!!

Let me know.

Thanks
 
More info?

Gunmann,
Where did you read that article? I carry a 642 w/+P and am interested in reading it. For what it's worth, I have had zero problems with mine. All I ever shoot is +P ammo.
Thanks
Y.D.
 
Internal Locks

See Jan/Feb American Handgunner Page 8 Coptalk by Massad Ayoob
GUN LOCK FAILURE. Some guns locked themselves during firing, some the battering of the +p's just pulverized the locks and caused a catastrophic failure.
Since very few PD's use revolvers anymore, and the ones that do aren't going to buy new ones only the civilian market will be affected and it will go unreported.

Can you picture internal locks on M16's for our military. The locks were thought up by lawyers who never shoot. A protection gun needs to work evey time. A free external lock was fine. But they had to mess with the design and force it on us.
I would love to sell my 642. Its been shot 1 cylinderfull and carried in a Kramer pocket holster. The finish is good on one side and scratched on the other.

I carry some until I locate one of the other models. But its going to have a new home soon as I find an older model. I also carry Glocks and 1911's when the weather allows me to. But in hot weather you are limited.
 
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On 21 JAN 05, I picked up a cherry S&W Airweight model 37
for $225. The gun does not have the lock, and is virtually UNFIRED
with only a faint drag line on the cylinder. Price was without box
tools, or papers but at that price I couldn't resist. Its blue, and
was made between NOV-DEC of 1993 as the BPFXXXX serial
indicates. Nope, shes not for sale folk's.

Best Wishes,
 
Ayoob is full of it. NO locks have ever been documented as failing anywhere. The allegation by some to that effct, is FALSE. I know of 0 locks that have ever failed in use.
 
I don't personally know of a lock failing, except in the aesthetics, common sense, and marketing genius category. I will not buy another one. I've had 2 and the weapons worked great, both scandium .357's. I couldn't stand the ugliness so sold both. I won't go there again. Luckily for me the older guns are what turns my cylinder. :)

To answer the question I have a titanium 342 without the lock and carry it almost every day either as back up or off duty. .38+P's are about all I can handle out of it, and they hurt. I shoot 10 rounds of standard .38 and 5 +P's a month. I've carried a centennial of some sort since 1990 and don't feel the need to shoot it more than that. Every once in a while I even skip the little gun altogether. :eek: I don't know how many titanium guns were made w/o the lock but I have one so there are a few. Keep looking and good luck.
 
Guns America has a bunch of 37, 37-2, 637, etc. without the lock and with the firing pin on the hammer. A local store just came up with a couple of dozen 37-2 revolvers that were in a warehouse for several years.
 
Got em

Found a 640 and a SS 649 Bodyguard without the internal locks.

Wouldnt mind having a 37 but these days it cool enough for me to carry my
Kimber 45 CDP Pro. I feel a lot better armed with it anyway. But each gun has its place and the snubbies are carried alot!!! :D
 
Where It Happened - They came apart

Three S&W ultra lights came apart at THE FIRING LINE RANGE in Manchester New Hampshire reported by Jim McLoud owner who wittnessed it. Sorry some of the "replyers" above didnt know but how would they???

A 342 Titanium firing +P+, A 340 Scandium firing 357's,.


In Rochester Indiana detective Dennis Richard firing his 329 Scandium 44 said the locks mechanism flew out while firing the gun.

It makes sense that extremly light handguns firing hot ammunition can be damaged by the battering, especially the unproven infernal lock!!

My 2 cents worth now check out the facts instead of saying "I never heard of it".
 
Some guns locked themselves during firing, some the battering of the +p's just pulverized the locks and caused a catastrophic failure.
Click to expand...

A "catastrophic failure" is when the gun blows up in a manner that destroys the gun and/or causes injury or death to the shooter. Having little bits fall out of the gun while shooting it does not fall into that category.

I usually respect Mas Ayoob's scribblings, but I'll take that with a grain of salt until I can read a verified account of an internal lock on a S&W break in a manner that renders the gun inoperable.
 
I regularly shoot .38Spcl +p and .357 Mag in my 340SC. It has never locked itself. While I find the locks mildly annoying, I locked mine once to try it and then unlocked it and put the keys in the case in the back of the gun stuff closet. I've regularly carried and fired this gun for over a year and never once has it malfunctioned. I find these reports dubious and wonder if it was something besides the locks that malfunctioned.
 
Get An Answer From The Horses Mouth

Why don't you just call Jim McCloud at the Range (603) 668-9015 and ask him what happened!!!

With my friend powder and brother ball, in your hands we equal all!

Author Unknown 1771
 
I've posted this on several other forums.

This happened sometime last summer.

I (an officer of the court :) ) can personally testify that the internal lock on my 3" 60-15 self-activated when I oafishly knocked the unloaded revolver from a countertop onto a hardwood floor. Not a huge amount of shock to the revolver, and a dropped gun is the type of thing that could certainly happen during a struggle.

The "firearm locked" flag did not rise after the fall, but the revolver was locked up. I fairly quickly put two and two together, dug the stupid "key" out of the box in the safe, and then unlocked the gun. No problems since, but I was disturbed to learn this could happen. (I put the "key" on my keyring after this incident, in case something similar happened when I was carrying the revolver.)

I've not had problems with the lock self-engaging at the range, even though I've fired some pretty stout loads (.357 Buffalo Bore 158-gr JHCs) through the little J-frame.

I've posted about this at THR, GT and the S&W forum already. IIRC, there were other folks at some of those forums who'd had lock problems. Perhaps, if any of you are interested, you might find more info there.
 
Hud Provision For Internal Locks

Just read that this was a political decision by the HCI followers to have guns that can be made inert. Read this quote

"I ask that you join Senator Shelby's (R-Alabama) sponsorship of legislation which would prohibit the Treasury Dept. from giving preference to Smith and Wesson Handguns. It is my understanding that Senator Feinstein is "vowing" to strip that language as soon as it gets to the Floor.

Being a deputy sheriff in Benson County, I know and trust my service sidearm. I carry a Glock handgun because of it's reliability and quality. As you know, Glock refused to compromise the lives of law abiding gun owners and law enforcement officers by not signing the HUD Agreement. Among with other provisions, this agreement calls for internal locking devices which can fail; S&W will now have to install these within 24 months. I, along with many other law abiding gun owners, feel that Glock, Beretta, Browning, and others, are being punished because they would not compromise on the American people's right to self-defense.

As a fellow Democrat, I support and uphold the Second Amendment to the
U. S. Constitution and urge you to support Senator Shelby and his sponsored legislation. Thank you, Kent for your attention to this matter.

Sincerely,

Deputy Matt Keesler
Benson County Sheriff's Office"


Three cheers for Deputy Keesler and For Glock who puts lives first before politically correct stupid decisions by a gun hating senator (Diane F that has a CHL and carries herself because her life is more important than yours!!!!!!!!!)
 
I just picked up a 37-2, no lock, firing pin on the hammer. Smith had a huge over run on a contract and there are hundreds of them available. One of the distributors in Montana had a couple of hundred last week.
 
How ironic it would be if a someone was injured or killed during an assault because he could not defend himself with a weapon rendered inoperable by a self-engaging lock. God forbid it should happen, but the legal ramifications would be interesting to observe.
 
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