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38/357 roll or taper crimp ?
- Thread starter rebs
- Start date
Average Joe
New member
38/357 both use a roll crimp for revolvers. Taper crimps are used mostly for auto loaders .
I use both depending on what i am loading. For the most part with light 38 special loads I taper crimp 75% of the time. Same with plated and coated bullets with no cannelure groove in both 357 and 38. I like a nice roll crimp on hotter 357 loads. While not cheap I like the redding profile and taper crimp dies.
condor bravo
New member
Well the usual intention is to use a roll crimp if the bullet has a cannelure (jacketed) or a crimping groove (cast). Also, if using a wadcutter bullet seated flush with the case mouth, enough of a roll crimp is used to just enclose the bullet within the case mouth. Taper crimping is used with non-cannelured bullets or cast lacking a crimp groove, or just simply to iron out a flared neck and not applying a crimp. Both crimp types can usually be satisfactorily applied with a roll crimp seating die, just a matter of adjusting the crimp pressure for the desired crimp. Most standard die sets, rifle and handgun calibers, include a roll crimp within the bullet seating die that can be used for roll, taper, or no crimp at all. The crimping is accomplished by a crimping shoulder within the seating die and crimps during bullet seating. A taper crimp only die is simply tapered inside the die and used after bullet seating with a separate seating die.
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Lost Sheep
New member
Thanks for asking our advice.
If you are shooting plated bullets, a roll crimp is to be avoided. It tends to cut into the plating and reportedly could lead to separation of the plating from the lead. Possibly a dangerous thing to happen, as it could leave a barrel obstruction.
Also note that more bullet retention is (supposed to be) by friction of the case walls on the bullet than by the mechanical grip of the case mouth roll. But both contribute.
I eschew a roll crimp for all but the heavier loads or slower powders. All that rolling cold-works the case mouth which eventually makes it brittle. If friction alone is not enough, my practice shooting tells me (by way of bullet creep), and then I will apply a roll in the future.
Good luck and thanks for asking our advice.
Lost Sheep
edit:
If you are shooting plated bullets, a roll crimp is to be avoided. It tends to cut into the plating and reportedly could lead to separation of the plating from the lead. Possibly a dangerous thing to happen, as it could leave a barrel obstruction.
Also note that more bullet retention is (supposed to be) by friction of the case walls on the bullet than by the mechanical grip of the case mouth roll. But both contribute.
I eschew a roll crimp for all but the heavier loads or slower powders. All that rolling cold-works the case mouth which eventually makes it brittle. If friction alone is not enough, my practice shooting tells me (by way of bullet creep), and then I will apply a roll in the future.
Good luck and thanks for asking our advice.
Lost Sheep
edit:
When using separate dies for roll or taper crimp (or the same die in successive, separate operations) seating and crimping separately can give you better control and a "cleaner" finished product. You see, when performing seating and crimping in the same operation, the crimp is applied at the same time as the bullet is being seated. Thus the case mouth is pressed onto/into the moving bullet. It is a lot easier to get the crimp adjusted on a stationary bullet than one that is still moving. (It is possible either way, just easier with the operations done separately).Condor Bravo said:A taper crimp only die is simply tapered inside the die and used after bullet seating with a separate seating die.
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Hammerhead
New member
You need a roll crimp for slow powders like 2400, W296/H110 to help them ignite uniformly.
You need a roll crimp with any full power 357 load to keep the bullets from pulling forward under recoil and hanging up the gun.
You need a roll crimp with all loads in ultra light revolvers because the increased recoil will pull bullets even with light loads.
I use taper crimp for light and medium 357 loads and all 38 loads.
I use a profile (roll) crimp for heavy 357 loads.
You need a roll crimp with any full power 357 load to keep the bullets from pulling forward under recoil and hanging up the gun.
You need a roll crimp with all loads in ultra light revolvers because the increased recoil will pull bullets even with light loads.
I use taper crimp for light and medium 357 loads and all 38 loads.
I use a profile (roll) crimp for heavy 357 loads.
Hammerhead
New member
I would recommend the Redding profile crimp, it will do a taper crimp when adjusted light or a nice roll crimp when adjusted heavy. I used it for years with all kinds of bullets including plated and soft swaged lead.
littlephil
New member
I have the Lee 4 die set with factory crimp die. I use a roll crimp for 357s and a light roll crimp for 38s with dewc that have a crimp groove. Most 38s I load though, get either plated dewc or hbwc bullets seated longer than normal with a roll crimp. This is just what I've found easiest and so far the Lee dies are real good for the money.
Good luck!
Good luck!
If you are shooting plated bullets, a roll crimp is to be avoided. It tends to cut into the plating and reportedly could lead to separation of the plating from the lead. Possibly a dangerous thing to happen, as it could leave a barrel obstruction.
Mmmmm NO not even close to the truth. Been loading Plated for close to 30 years and this advice grossly misinterpreted. Do not OVER CRIMP plated is much closer to the truth. Not all Plated bullets are made the same...some have a whisp of plating, some have a real good layer on them. Some have a super soft alloy of lead used and some have a much harder alloy of lead under that plating.
Speer Gold Dots and UniCores are PLATED bulletes.. they are on one end of the spectrum.
Lost Sheep
New member
Well, OK, maybe I should have stated a deep roll crimp is to be avoided. But it reads to me that "grossly misinterpreted" is not close to the truth either. You seem to agree that "OVER CRIMP" is less than desirable.SHR970 said:Mmmmm NO not even close to the truth. Been loading Plated for close to 30 years and this advice grossly misinterpreted. Do not OVER CRIMP plated is much closer to the truth. Not all Plated bullets are made the same...Lost Sheep said:If you are shooting plated bullets, a roll crimp is to be avoided. It tends to cut into the plating and reportedly could lead to separation of the plating from the lead. Possibly a dangerous thing to happen, as it could leave a barrel obstruction.
(edited for focus from post #10)
In any event, I do not (roll) crimp into bullets without a cannelure or crimping groove.
I have never seen soft lead blown out of a damaged plating while still in the barrel. nor known anyone who has, but I can see how it could happen. Just because hundreds or thousands of shooters over decades have not had it happen does not mean that it has not happened to a few. The mechanism is there.
Lost Sheep
jetinteriorguy
New member
In my .38 I just remove the belling, in my .357 I use a Lee collet crimp die. Two reasons I love the collet crimp die. First, it's less fussy with untrimmed cases of slightly different length, and second it doesn't overwork the brass as much as a roll crimp. I do crimp all my .357 loads since I run them through both my revolvers and my Henry.