Seminole1986
New member
OK, how do these two rounds compare?
357 Sig v. 9mm +p+
- Thread starter Seminole1986
- Start date
save your money
In the end, they are both 9mm bullets. A 9mm bullet can only expand so much. The difference is about 100-150 fps velocity. I say stick with 9mm and don't fall for the .355-Sucker. You'll be able to afford to practice and ammo is readily avaoilable everywhere. I really don't have a problem with the .355 Sig, but look at is from a practicality perspective. Or just bump up to a 40S&W or so.
Ben
In the end, they are both 9mm bullets. A 9mm bullet can only expand so much. The difference is about 100-150 fps velocity. I say stick with 9mm and don't fall for the .355-Sucker. You'll be able to afford to practice and ammo is readily avaoilable everywhere. I really don't have a problem with the .355 Sig, but look at is from a practicality perspective. Or just bump up to a 40S&W or so.
Ben
With a good bullet I would think the SIG will perform like the .357 mag which is much better tham most for a stopper. The 125 gr. area is about the same with both rounds on speed. I would expect this round to be one of the best stop the BG rounds ever if you can live with the blast and recoil.
P
PreserveFreedom
Guest
I think that 357sig is a good idea if you plan on having a spare barrel so you can shoot either 40S&W or 357sig. If you just want solely to shoot 357sig, you are probably better off swinging to 9mm.
M
M58
Guest
Very close in the same weight.
357 Magnum is just a ~9mm bullet. 357 Sig gives you 357 Magnum performance in a high-capacity gun. There is no reason to believe that 115 grain 9mm coming out of a Glock 357 Sig is less effective than a 110 grain 357 Magnum coming out of a 4 inch S&W Revolver. In fact, most tests show that the 357 Sig slightly outperform the 357 magnum in the lighter bullet weights. History has shown the 110 grain 357 Magnum to be a superior fightstopper--probably the best. The 357 Sig will match this in an easier to shoot package (with substantialy higher capacity).
OTOH, the 9mm is an excellent round. World Wars and nearly universal police and military use have shown it to be very effective. I recently read an article in one of the gun rags that claimed that 45 was ~95% effective (OSS)while the 9mm was less than 25% effective. No offense to anyone who believes this, but articles like this are the reason I don't buy gun magazines when I can read them at the store.
Also, the 357 SIG is very easy to control. Blast and recoil are basically 9mm +p+.
OTOH, the 9mm is an excellent round. World Wars and nearly universal police and military use have shown it to be very effective. I recently read an article in one of the gun rags that claimed that 45 was ~95% effective (OSS)while the 9mm was less than 25% effective. No offense to anyone who believes this, but articles like this are the reason I don't buy gun magazines when I can read them at the store.
Also, the 357 SIG is very easy to control. Blast and recoil are basically 9mm +p+.
.357 Sig < .357 magnum
Several posters to this thread have suggested that the .357/.355 Sig provides performance equal to the .357 magnum. As frequently discussed over the last years, this is fundamentally untrue.
At best, the .357 Sig provides roughly equivalent performance ONLY at the low-mass end of the .357 magnum spectrum, for example with 125 grain rounds. Once we analyze heavier projectiles, the .357 Sig cannot compare with the .357 magnum. To illustrate:
.357 Sig 125 grain 1350 FPS 510 pounds muzzle energy
.357 mag 180 grain 1250 FPS 625 pounds muzzle energy
I am not suggesting the .357 Sig is a poor round; in fact, I prefer it in the 9mm autoloader category. However, let's not erroneously propose that it's equivalent to the .357 magnum when it is not.
Several posters to this thread have suggested that the .357/.355 Sig provides performance equal to the .357 magnum. As frequently discussed over the last years, this is fundamentally untrue.
At best, the .357 Sig provides roughly equivalent performance ONLY at the low-mass end of the .357 magnum spectrum, for example with 125 grain rounds. Once we analyze heavier projectiles, the .357 Sig cannot compare with the .357 magnum. To illustrate:
.357 Sig 125 grain 1350 FPS 510 pounds muzzle energy
.357 mag 180 grain 1250 FPS 625 pounds muzzle energy
I am not suggesting the .357 Sig is a poor round; in fact, I prefer it in the 9mm autoloader category. However, let's not erroneously propose that it's equivalent to the .357 magnum when it is not.
juliet charley
New member
Greg -
"History has shown the 110 grain 357 Magnum to be a superior fightstopper--probably the best. The 357 Sig will match this in an easier to shoot package (with substantialy higher capacity). " ???????
I think history has shown the 125 grain .357 Magnum to be the superior fightstopper--not the 110 grain which can suffer from underpenetration problems from service length revolvers. Are you sure you don’t write for a gun magazine?
Actually, the 125 grain reiterations of 357 Sig will probably approach the effectiveness of the .357 Magnum (the actual bullets do perform different by design with Sig holding together better). The 357 Sig will lose in the versatility market (as do all pistols)--particularly at the upper end, but this is NOT a .357 Magnum versus a 357 Sig thread.
In terms of the original post (9 mm +P+ versus .357 Sig), I think if I wanted to shoot +P+ ammunition, I would go with the Sig NOT because it is a better round, but because the pistols designed for the Sig (most actually designed for the .40 Short and Weak) are built to handle hotter rounds (hopefully) than the pistols built to handle 9 mm (e.g., there are significant frame differences between the 9 mm Glocks and the Sig Glocks). I think a steady diet of +P+ ammunition through most 9 mm pistols would batter them sooner or later effecting reliablity and durability.
"History has shown the 110 grain 357 Magnum to be a superior fightstopper--probably the best. The 357 Sig will match this in an easier to shoot package (with substantialy higher capacity). " ???????
I think history has shown the 125 grain .357 Magnum to be the superior fightstopper--not the 110 grain which can suffer from underpenetration problems from service length revolvers. Are you sure you don’t write for a gun magazine?
Actually, the 125 grain reiterations of 357 Sig will probably approach the effectiveness of the .357 Magnum (the actual bullets do perform different by design with Sig holding together better). The 357 Sig will lose in the versatility market (as do all pistols)--particularly at the upper end, but this is NOT a .357 Magnum versus a 357 Sig thread.
In terms of the original post (9 mm +P+ versus .357 Sig), I think if I wanted to shoot +P+ ammunition, I would go with the Sig NOT because it is a better round, but because the pistols designed for the Sig (most actually designed for the .40 Short and Weak) are built to handle hotter rounds (hopefully) than the pistols built to handle 9 mm (e.g., there are significant frame differences between the 9 mm Glocks and the Sig Glocks). I think a steady diet of +P+ ammunition through most 9 mm pistols would batter them sooner or later effecting reliablity and durability.
longevity of 9mm vs. 357 Sig
It is my understanding that the 9mm versions of many pistols eventually benefit from most if not all of the design improvements regarding the stress of 40/357 models.
The Glock 19,32, and 23 all have the same outside dimensions and use the same weight of recoil spring. The addition of a second locking block pin is the only real difference of the 40/357 autos over the 9. No major change was needed to the Beretta 92fs to create the .40 caliber version 96. The 357 sig has an SAAMI maximum limit of 40,000 psi. The 9mm+P has a limit of 38,500. It is not uncommon for 147 gr. 9mm to generate pressures as high as lighter +p+ loads. Also, one doesn't need to shoot full power 9mm loads all the time. Since it is somewhat correct to think of a 40/357 glock as a bored out 9mm, I think the greater wall thicknes of the 9's barrel/chamber needs to be factored in. Bullet setback appears to be a greater cause of concern in the 357 than the 40 or 9. The 40 tends to have a problematic pressure curve. Both the 357 and 40 are capable of higher kenetic energy and power factor(recoil formula) than 9mm+P+. Therefore, I doubt that a 40 or 357 will last longer than a 9 even if a lot of +P or +P+ loads are used.
However,I am not a gunsmith or armorer. I do not know for certain if what I have said is 100% correct. This is based upon part of my reading and limited handling of these guns.
It is my understanding that the 9mm versions of many pistols eventually benefit from most if not all of the design improvements regarding the stress of 40/357 models.
The Glock 19,32, and 23 all have the same outside dimensions and use the same weight of recoil spring. The addition of a second locking block pin is the only real difference of the 40/357 autos over the 9. No major change was needed to the Beretta 92fs to create the .40 caliber version 96. The 357 sig has an SAAMI maximum limit of 40,000 psi. The 9mm+P has a limit of 38,500. It is not uncommon for 147 gr. 9mm to generate pressures as high as lighter +p+ loads. Also, one doesn't need to shoot full power 9mm loads all the time. Since it is somewhat correct to think of a 40/357 glock as a bored out 9mm, I think the greater wall thicknes of the 9's barrel/chamber needs to be factored in. Bullet setback appears to be a greater cause of concern in the 357 than the 40 or 9. The 40 tends to have a problematic pressure curve. Both the 357 and 40 are capable of higher kenetic energy and power factor(recoil formula) than 9mm+P+. Therefore, I doubt that a 40 or 357 will last longer than a 9 even if a lot of +P or +P+ loads are used.
However,I am not a gunsmith or armorer. I do not know for certain if what I have said is 100% correct. This is based upon part of my reading and limited handling of these guns.
"JacknKoch"--that is the best screen name I have ever seen. 
The great thing about the 357 SIG is that you can ignore the whole bullet debate. The 110-125 grain 357 Magnum is a phenomenal fight stopper. When somebody starts arguing that these rounds are not effective the proper response is to roll your eyes. The specs shows that the 357 Sig matches these rounds in weight and velocity. Some clods might argue that 125 grain goes 1500+ out of an 8 inch revolver--but how many really carry this gun? Cor-Bon 115 grain will hit 1500 out of a Glock full size or Sig 226.
If you are sensible enough to ignore the bullet debate, the 9mm is probably the best all-around personal defense round. It is cheap and comfortable to practice with. If you need speed simply pick up a box of Triton or Cor-bon. All of the best modern handgun designs were designed with the 9mm in mind--most of them sturdy enough to take all the 9mm you could ever feed them.
GHB
The great thing about the 357 SIG is that you can ignore the whole bullet debate. The 110-125 grain 357 Magnum is a phenomenal fight stopper. When somebody starts arguing that these rounds are not effective the proper response is to roll your eyes. The specs shows that the 357 Sig matches these rounds in weight and velocity. Some clods might argue that 125 grain goes 1500+ out of an 8 inch revolver--but how many really carry this gun? Cor-Bon 115 grain will hit 1500 out of a Glock full size or Sig 226.
If you are sensible enough to ignore the bullet debate, the 9mm is probably the best all-around personal defense round. It is cheap and comfortable to practice with. If you need speed simply pick up a box of Triton or Cor-bon. All of the best modern handgun designs were designed with the 9mm in mind--most of them sturdy enough to take all the 9mm you could ever feed them.
GHB
The 357 Sig is like a ship at sea looking for a friendly port. It's just another spoke in a big wheel. Cops wanted 357 magnum performance in a auto pistol. I think that part has been achieved. If it was my first auto pistol purchase I think it would be a viable choice. Personally, since I already have a hi-cap 9mm there's no need for the 357 Sig. If you want to step up get a 45. There's a bunch of street results in 9mm, 45, and 357 mag. Not much data on the 357 Sig. I know, I know, it looks promising. Well, promising don't cut it. If 16 rounds of 9mm+P isn't enough then what is? Most new 357 Sig owners will never see a hi-cap mag. Eleven rounds with a little more power....Hmmmm...I'll pass. Just my thoughts, J. Parker
If you want to safely outperform the 357 Magnum with a 125 gr slug, why not try the 9X23 Win? You can easily push it past the 357 Magnum, with less noise and blast.
I don't do it all the time, but I can push a 125 gr slug up to 1700 fps. The secret is in the 9X23 case, which is from Winchester. It allows an obscene amount of pressure! You just need to be careful of the primers, and make sure you are using small rifle primers.
Casey
I don't do it all the time, but I can push a 125 gr slug up to 1700 fps. The secret is in the 9X23 case, which is from Winchester. It allows an obscene amount of pressure! You just need to be careful of the primers, and make sure you are using small rifle primers.
Casey