Davelliott
New member
This pistol cartridge is the culmination of a dream I had in 1982...to have a pistol cartridge in a rimless, slightly tapered cartridge to increase cartridge capacity and performance in a semi-auto. Back then, it was a 1911.
Now that pistol design, metallurgy and power chemistry have matured, and bullet designs are better, I began work on this in 2015.
I've converted both a Glock 29 and a Glock 20 to this new cartridge.
Where the Glock 29 holds 10 rounds of 10mm, it holds 11 rounds of 357 Ring Of Fire.
In the Glock 20, which holds 15 rounds of 10mm, it will hold 18 rounds of 357 Ring Of Fire, all with no modifications to the magazines!
I've had a friend run some numbers for me through his Quickload program, for each bullet weight and length to have pressures between 37,000psi and 45,000psi (the maximum rated pressure for the parent cartridge-the 9mm Winchester Magnum).
The velocities he sent me were as follows, with Alliant Power Pistol powder:
1. 1581 feet per second with125 gr. Speer Jacketed Hollow Points, Jacketed Soft Points and Total Metal Jacket.
2. 1436 feet per second with140 gr. Hornady XTP
3. 1384 feet per second with 147 gr. Hornady XTP
4. 1327 feet per second with 158 gr. Speer Deep Curl Hollow Points
5. 1189 feet per second with 170 gr. Speer Deep Curl Soft Points.
6. 976 feet per second with 200 gr. Lead Round Nose. This may go up with the right powder.
I have shot these loads and found them to be very accurate. The only problem I've found is availability of components to make more ammunition.
The one major issue I've been addressing with these are some military criteria... for combat, these must reach a Thornily Relative Stopping Power of 50 for an effective stop of an aggressor.
1. The 125 gr bullets reach 48.
2. The 140 gr. bullets reach 49.
3. The 147 gr. bullets reach 49.
4. The 158 gr. bullets reach 51.
5. The 170 gr. bullets reach 49.
6. The 200 gr, bullets reach 48.
Now all these velocities can increase with other powders which are not available at this time.
Keep in mind that the current military cartridge reaches 33-37 on this scale...and the 45 ACP reaches 50-54...still in reach of my cartridges when better powders become available.
Patents have been applied for and accepted by the PTO.
I have also applied for my ATF 7 license from the BATFE.
I have a business license from the State of Virginia for the Ring Of Fire Manufacturing, LLC.
I also have my Henrico County Business license for the Ring Of Fire Manufacturing, LLC.
I have arrangements with BAR-STO to make my pistol barrels and gunsmith fit them for my customers.
In addition, I have agreements with Wolff Springs for recoil rods and springs.
The cartridge was cut down to the length of a 10mm casing-@.988.
The Over All Length was reduced to @ 1.280 to accommodate more pistols, like the 38 Super+P, and the 9X23mm pistols.
1911 style pistols can be converted if they're able to withstand the pressures of the 10mm and 9X23mm.
The 1911 style pistols in 40 S&W, 38 Super+P, 9X23mm and 10mm can all be converted with only a barrel and recoil spring tuning.
Now, I'm also looking to make ammunition for this, so there will be no foul-ups like there was with the 9X23...ammo wasn't available, or pistols weren't available due to the rift with Winchester...and I'm planning to also make most other hard to find ammunition as well.
Low end ammunition will be sold under Ring Of Fire MFG.LLC with the Marksman designation.
Mid-range ammunition will be sold with the Sharpshooter designation.
High-end self-defense and hunting grade will be designated under the Expert badge.
These will be images of my Marine Corps Shooting Badges.
I will also list on the packages, brass make, powder, charge, primer, bullet, feet per second with realistic barrel lengths (not the 10" barrels most manufacturers use today), and the Thornily Relative Stopping Power of the round as well as the chart showing what power is recommended for specific game.
The cartridge and the chamber design is protected under patent application. I have both provisional and design patents applied for.
I do have some videos on youtube when I was doing some R&D. Look under Dave Elliott 357 Ring Of Fire.
There is also a Facebook page under Dave Elliott 357 Ring Of Fire.
Anyone interested in preorders, loading info, etc...send me your queries at
davelliott1957@yahoo.com
Thanks guys, for all your input.
Dave
Now that pistol design, metallurgy and power chemistry have matured, and bullet designs are better, I began work on this in 2015.
I've converted both a Glock 29 and a Glock 20 to this new cartridge.
Where the Glock 29 holds 10 rounds of 10mm, it holds 11 rounds of 357 Ring Of Fire.
In the Glock 20, which holds 15 rounds of 10mm, it will hold 18 rounds of 357 Ring Of Fire, all with no modifications to the magazines!
I've had a friend run some numbers for me through his Quickload program, for each bullet weight and length to have pressures between 37,000psi and 45,000psi (the maximum rated pressure for the parent cartridge-the 9mm Winchester Magnum).
The velocities he sent me were as follows, with Alliant Power Pistol powder:
1. 1581 feet per second with125 gr. Speer Jacketed Hollow Points, Jacketed Soft Points and Total Metal Jacket.
2. 1436 feet per second with140 gr. Hornady XTP
3. 1384 feet per second with 147 gr. Hornady XTP
4. 1327 feet per second with 158 gr. Speer Deep Curl Hollow Points
5. 1189 feet per second with 170 gr. Speer Deep Curl Soft Points.
6. 976 feet per second with 200 gr. Lead Round Nose. This may go up with the right powder.
I have shot these loads and found them to be very accurate. The only problem I've found is availability of components to make more ammunition.
The one major issue I've been addressing with these are some military criteria... for combat, these must reach a Thornily Relative Stopping Power of 50 for an effective stop of an aggressor.
1. The 125 gr bullets reach 48.
2. The 140 gr. bullets reach 49.
3. The 147 gr. bullets reach 49.
4. The 158 gr. bullets reach 51.
5. The 170 gr. bullets reach 49.
6. The 200 gr, bullets reach 48.
Now all these velocities can increase with other powders which are not available at this time.
Keep in mind that the current military cartridge reaches 33-37 on this scale...and the 45 ACP reaches 50-54...still in reach of my cartridges when better powders become available.
Patents have been applied for and accepted by the PTO.
I have also applied for my ATF 7 license from the BATFE.
I have a business license from the State of Virginia for the Ring Of Fire Manufacturing, LLC.
I also have my Henrico County Business license for the Ring Of Fire Manufacturing, LLC.
I have arrangements with BAR-STO to make my pistol barrels and gunsmith fit them for my customers.
In addition, I have agreements with Wolff Springs for recoil rods and springs.
The cartridge was cut down to the length of a 10mm casing-@.988.
The Over All Length was reduced to @ 1.280 to accommodate more pistols, like the 38 Super+P, and the 9X23mm pistols.
1911 style pistols can be converted if they're able to withstand the pressures of the 10mm and 9X23mm.
The 1911 style pistols in 40 S&W, 38 Super+P, 9X23mm and 10mm can all be converted with only a barrel and recoil spring tuning.
Now, I'm also looking to make ammunition for this, so there will be no foul-ups like there was with the 9X23...ammo wasn't available, or pistols weren't available due to the rift with Winchester...and I'm planning to also make most other hard to find ammunition as well.
Low end ammunition will be sold under Ring Of Fire MFG.LLC with the Marksman designation.
Mid-range ammunition will be sold with the Sharpshooter designation.
High-end self-defense and hunting grade will be designated under the Expert badge.
These will be images of my Marine Corps Shooting Badges.
I will also list on the packages, brass make, powder, charge, primer, bullet, feet per second with realistic barrel lengths (not the 10" barrels most manufacturers use today), and the Thornily Relative Stopping Power of the round as well as the chart showing what power is recommended for specific game.
The cartridge and the chamber design is protected under patent application. I have both provisional and design patents applied for.
I do have some videos on youtube when I was doing some R&D. Look under Dave Elliott 357 Ring Of Fire.
There is also a Facebook page under Dave Elliott 357 Ring Of Fire.
Anyone interested in preorders, loading info, etc...send me your queries at
davelliott1957@yahoo.com
Thanks guys, for all your input.
Dave