357 mag problem

jim8115

New member
4 revolvers , S&W 686+ , Ruger GP100 , S&W Mod 28 , brand new Ruger Sp101

4 loads , all 158 Gr jhp / jsp
14.0 2400
16.5 H-110
8.0 Power pistol
6.3 CSB-1

all loads work fine in every gun EXCEPT the SP-101 , all show sticky extraction in that one to a degree.Removing them one at a time, none are stuck bad, but with all five, its enough combined resistance to be fairly hard to extract.

UMC 125 Gr JSP ( only factory ammo I could find ) doesnt stick in it.

Jim
 
Has the SP 101 been fired previously with .38 Specials ? Double check closely for lead or carbon residue in the cylinders.
 
Rugers are known to have rough chambers. A polish job may help. Your loads are at the upper level with the powders I'm familiar with. The 16.5 load of H110 is even over max in some manuals. If the SP-101 has rough/dirty chambers or tight chambers/throats, it easy to see why you would have sticky extraction. The reason we as handloaders are told to start low and work up as we watch for signs of excess pressure is because not all firearms are created equal. Just because a max load is safe in the book does not make it safe in every gun. My PC .460 has tight throats and thus most loads above mid level lead to sticky extraction. In some manuals I can't get much above start levels. But many times I get velocities that are higher than shown. But velocity to me in all my handguns is a moot point. I load for accuracy and the majority of times that comes before I get to the upper levels of my load manuals.
 
You work up the loads or just pick 'em? You work up the loads for each revolver or just hope? They're all close to max, not over, according to Hodgdon and Alliant. No handgun data on Maxam's site.
Should matter but what's the barrel length on the SP? If it's one of the little fellows you might just be a bit too hot. Isn't likely though. You did clean it first?
"...Rugers are known to have rough chambers..." Um, no they don't. No firearm manufacturer is more frightened of law suits than Ruger.
 
T. O'Heir,

That may be, but they can still make tight chambers that may increase pressure. Example: I have a Ruger Redhawk that has 5 chambers that shoot into about 5/8" C.T.C. at 50 yards, and the sixth chamber opens that up about 1 5/8". A friend of mine was so impressed by it that he bought a copy. His wouldn't stay on a dinner plate at that distance. All chambers all over the map. So we sent the gun back to Ruger with a note explaining how well my copy shot compared to his. His came back 5 weeks later with a note saying the cylinder (chambers) had been reamed. The gun then shot well. So, despite their concerns, we know Ruger can still turn out a tight chamber when its reamers get worn, or there would have been nothing for them to ream in my friend's cylinder. Those tight chambers, in turn, affect pressure.


Jim8115,

Tight extraction is a classic pressure sign for revolvers. Steel can stretch further than brass can and still return to shape. Steel makes a better spring for this reason. When case extraction becomes sticky, it generally means the steel at the inside diameter of the chamber is expanding beyond the brass's spring limit (its yield point). As a result, the steel snaps back to shape over top of the now-slightly-oversize brass, trapping it and causing the difficult extraction.

If you get sticky extraction from your handloads and not from commercial loads, it's a pretty definite sign of excess pressure. At the least, your loads are making higher pressure than the commercial loads are. Some guns will take that, especially if the cylinder walls at the thinnest part of the chamber, the outside edge, are thicker than the 101's. That's something you can measure with a caliper well enough for comparison purposes. In the meanwhile, sticky extraction in a revolver means knock the loads for this gun down 5% from the level at which sticking begins.

So, why are your loads warmer: You used a different lot of powder than the manual did. You used a different primer. You used different, possibly thinner brass. You used a different bullet that is either harder (thicker jacket) or that seats more deeply when the crimp cannelure is at the case mouth than did the bullet the load data was developed with. All these things can cause some differences in pressure individually, and in combination they can add up. This is why published load data is more like a suggestion than a rule, especially when you near maximum.

You could get the lighter gun's chambers reamed. You could also have bore that's a little tight or constricted where it screws into the frame. If you can measure that the chambers are tight, Ruger might be willing to ream them, but you need to complain about accuracy, and not handload problems if you do. No gun maker likes to encourage or make accommodations for hand loads for liability reasons.
 
Have not slugged the bore
Does not appear to be out of time
All loads are hand weighed one at a time, with check done with two scales to verify
the 2400 and h-110 loads are near max, but not over according to the manuals I have, lyman, hornady, and sierra
 
UMC 125 Gr JSP ( only factory ammo I could find ) doesnt stick in it.

That is loaded to legitimate magnum velocities. If that is not sticking, that tells me something.

the 2400 and h-110 loads are near max, but not over according to the manuals I have, lyman, hornady, and sierra

Again....not over max in your manuals, but maybe close to max in that particular firearm. While I don't have the newest Hornady manual, I do have their 7th edition and it shows a max of 16 gr of H110/W296 with their bullet. Speer shows a max of 15.5 of H110/W296 with their 158 pill. Using a 158 pill that seats deeper and uses more case capacity will increase pressure also, as will tight chambers/throats. The only way to really know if the loads are max in your firearm is to either pressure test them or chrono them. Otherwise, if polishing the chambers do not solve your problem, then I would back down with the loads in that gun.


As others have asked, did you work up the load or just start at the numbers shown? If you worked up you should have noticed when extraction went from normal to sticky.
 
I worked them up in the GP100. I really would think that a brand new , quality firearm should work with any published load , especially since all those loads work out of 3 other 357;s

JIM
 
As stated on the thr if your cylinder chambers look like mine thats the issue.
I have a few professional tenured gunsmiths tell me that is the exact reason mine
Has a hard time ejecting the cases.

If my garbage rossi and Taurus .357s can eject the same loads this should be the same case with the sp101.

I ordered my flex hone for my cylinder chambers. I suggest you do the same.
 
DougGuy worked my revolvers throats & forcing cones , the sp101 had 356 throats !!

I knew they were titer than any of the rest ,but if yours is the same that`s enuff to affect pressures.

Be careful workin on the hi end with multiple firearms !!

Maybe an upper mid loading will suit all the firearms taste ???

Thanks to Doug I now own 38/357 revolvers with only a .0005" difference , yes he`s THAT GOOD & has the correct reamers & pilots to do it with!!!!


GP
 
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