Rob Pincus
New member
Who can tell me anything about this round?
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
.308 Magnum??
- Thread starter Rob Pincus
- Start date
I presume that you mean the .308 Norma Magnum.
This fine cartridge gets nothing like the attention that it should from American shooters, due to the prevalence of the .300 Win Mag in the same action size.
It is nearly identical to the .300 Win Mag, but it has a longer neck, very slightly less powder capacity, and better inherent accuracy. The lesser powder capacity of the Norma is offset by the fact that you do not need to seat the bullets so deep as in the .300 Win Mag, thereby losing powder capacity in that round.
The longer neck of the Norma allows better bullet seating, as seen in the difference between the .270 (Longer neck) and 30-06 (shorter neck) cases.
This fine cartridge gets nothing like the attention that it should from American shooters, due to the prevalence of the .300 Win Mag in the same action size.
It is nearly identical to the .300 Win Mag, but it has a longer neck, very slightly less powder capacity, and better inherent accuracy. The lesser powder capacity of the Norma is offset by the fact that you do not need to seat the bullets so deep as in the .300 Win Mag, thereby losing powder capacity in that round.
The longer neck of the Norma allows better bullet seating, as seen in the difference between the .270 (Longer neck) and 30-06 (shorter neck) cases.
If, as suggested above, you are referring to the 308 Norma Magnum, you have hit upon a much overlooked round. If you wish to rebarrel a rifle action of suitable length, this is a good round to choose. The only thing I can fault it for is the belted case. I find the "cosmetic" belt to be a waste on any rifle round I can think of right now and, would choose an unbelted round this day and time.
The trend to beltless rifle brass seems to be catching on with the new Remington 300 Ultra being the latest in this trend.
Performance wise, I think it is a near twin of the 300 Winchester Magnum. If I'm not mistaken, it will fit in some long rifle actions and does not require the magnum length action. If you handload, 338 Winchester brass seems to be an easy conversion for 308 Norma Magnum rounds or, you can always purchase loaded rounds from a dealer who stocks or can order Norma brand loaded ammunition. I'm not that knowledgeable on this particular round so, feel free to chime in if I'm off base.
Sid
The trend to beltless rifle brass seems to be catching on with the new Remington 300 Ultra being the latest in this trend.
Performance wise, I think it is a near twin of the 300 Winchester Magnum. If I'm not mistaken, it will fit in some long rifle actions and does not require the magnum length action. If you handload, 338 Winchester brass seems to be an easy conversion for 308 Norma Magnum rounds or, you can always purchase loaded rounds from a dealer who stocks or can order Norma brand loaded ammunition. I'm not that knowledgeable on this particular round so, feel free to chime in if I'm off base.
Sid
To the short-necked complaints I hear on the .300 Win Mag, I say, "Pish and Tosh!" (you really ought to try this, too; it just feel fun to say, on occasion....) My .300 Win Mag, and all of the others that I have handled or know of among my friends, are exceptionally accurate rifles. Inherently, the accuracy problem that supposedly is going to rear its ugly head just doesn't happen. I've even been experimenting lately with the 180's loaded WAY out of the case, extending COAL by something like .15" or more, and no problems with accuracy (didn't improve it, either, though: I was trying to shorten the free-bore).
That said, however, it is certainly a fact that the Norma Magnum is (was) a great cartridge with no flaws beyond its scarcity on the shelves, the tiny selection of loads and, of course the silly belt, that my .300 Win Mag shares with it.
If you have a quantity of the brass for it, and reload anyway, I'd say go for it. If you don't reload, and don't plan to, I'd say give it a miss. There are great advantages to being in the mainstream on things like rifle cartridges. I know that, although I hunt with my own ammo and, in fact, my rifle is a "Factory Virgin" (has NEVER fired a round of factory-loaded ammo), I can walk into any Wal Mart or Gibson's or gun store and walk out with a box of .300 Win Mag 180 grain cartridges by a reputable company.
The .308 Norma suffered from bad timing.
Regards,
L.P.
That said, however, it is certainly a fact that the Norma Magnum is (was) a great cartridge with no flaws beyond its scarcity on the shelves, the tiny selection of loads and, of course the silly belt, that my .300 Win Mag shares with it.
If you have a quantity of the brass for it, and reload anyway, I'd say go for it. If you don't reload, and don't plan to, I'd say give it a miss. There are great advantages to being in the mainstream on things like rifle cartridges. I know that, although I hunt with my own ammo and, in fact, my rifle is a "Factory Virgin" (has NEVER fired a round of factory-loaded ammo), I can walk into any Wal Mart or Gibson's or gun store and walk out with a box of .300 Win Mag 180 grain cartridges by a reputable company.
The .308 Norma suffered from bad timing.
Regards,
L.P.
Keith Rogan
New member
Long Path,
You don't mention what kind of rifle you have. Many factory .300 Win Mags are simply 30.06's with a .300 Win Mag barrel. I learned that sad fact trying to reload .300's for a friend with a Ruger rifle.
I had to seat the 180's deeper than I liked so that they'd fit in his magazine. Long jump, poor accuracy. Deep seat, higher pressure. You can't win if you can't fit them in the magazine.
I'll bet a lot of the complaints about this round are due to the rifles rather than the round itself.
------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan
You don't mention what kind of rifle you have. Many factory .300 Win Mags are simply 30.06's with a .300 Win Mag barrel. I learned that sad fact trying to reload .300's for a friend with a Ruger rifle.
I had to seat the 180's deeper than I liked so that they'd fit in his magazine. Long jump, poor accuracy. Deep seat, higher pressure. You can't win if you can't fit them in the magazine.
I'll bet a lot of the complaints about this round are due to the rifles rather than the round itself.
------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan
Rob Pincus
New member
In fact, I was told by an aquaintance that he had a rifle chambered in this calibre and was told by a gunshop that it, in fact, did not exist.
I thought I'd heard of it and knew that someone around here would be able to help me.
Next question:
Where can someone get ammo??
I thought I'd heard of it and knew that someone around here would be able to help me.
Next question:
Where can someone get ammo??
Hi Rob,
Just to add a little to the previous information. The .308 Norma Magnum was once a very popular round for rechambering US Model 1917 actions, since it loaded and fed through the magazine without extensive alterations.
This is why anyone buying a "sporterized" Model 1917 (U.S. Enfield) should check the chamber before firing.
The cartridge has never been loaded in this country, but Norma still makes it. Cartridges can be made from several belted cases.
Jim
Just to add a little to the previous information. The .308 Norma Magnum was once a very popular round for rechambering US Model 1917 actions, since it loaded and fed through the magazine without extensive alterations.
This is why anyone buying a "sporterized" Model 1917 (U.S. Enfield) should check the chamber before firing.
The cartridge has never been loaded in this country, but Norma still makes it. Cartridges can be made from several belted cases.
Jim
Chucko: Rifle wouldn't be chambered for the Hornady load.
Jim: Darned good advice! 'Smatter of fact, ANY "sporterized" service rifle should be double-checked. Some gunsmiths were annealing the receiver of old Springfields, back in the day, so that they could work on them (metal was toooo hard). Then they weren't properly re-hardening them, and gave their client back a time bomb. Well, if the client then shot mild loads through it and sold it to a dealer who sold it to you, and you put your fave romp'em stomp'em hunting load through it.... Boom. When I bought my previously sporterized Springfield, I took a ball peen hammer to the receiver several times before I shot it. Nobody ever said Springfield were that pretty, anyway, and I felt better when the sear broke over a heavy load for the first time.
Keith: Mine's a Sendero, and my friend's is a Savage 110. Another friend sold his old M-77 in CO on his last elk trip to two fellows who couldn't believe a magnum could print such tiny groups, and wouldn't take no for an answer.
We all trade loads, and have good success.
Good point on the rifle comment, though-- There's no way I'd put these 180's at 3100 all day long through a lesser rifle, and mine has enough capacity that I can load the bullets pretty much out to whereever I want them. My friend with the Ruger was loading out little 130 grain pill and crimping with the Lee collet crimper, and making neat clover leafs. Problem is that the brass life is much shorter with those collet crimps. Perhaps situations like that would be better off with the longer-necked Norma Mag.
Jim: Darned good advice! 'Smatter of fact, ANY "sporterized" service rifle should be double-checked. Some gunsmiths were annealing the receiver of old Springfields, back in the day, so that they could work on them (metal was toooo hard). Then they weren't properly re-hardening them, and gave their client back a time bomb. Well, if the client then shot mild loads through it and sold it to a dealer who sold it to you, and you put your fave romp'em stomp'em hunting load through it.... Boom. When I bought my previously sporterized Springfield, I took a ball peen hammer to the receiver several times before I shot it. Nobody ever said Springfield were that pretty, anyway, and I felt better when the sear broke over a heavy load for the first time.
Keith: Mine's a Sendero, and my friend's is a Savage 110. Another friend sold his old M-77 in CO on his last elk trip to two fellows who couldn't believe a magnum could print such tiny groups, and wouldn't take no for an answer.
We all trade loads, and have good success.
Good point on the rifle comment, though-- There's no way I'd put these 180's at 3100 all day long through a lesser rifle, and mine has enough capacity that I can load the bullets pretty much out to whereever I want them. My friend with the Ruger was loading out little 130 grain pill and crimping with the Lee collet crimper, and making neat clover leafs. Problem is that the brass life is much shorter with those collet crimps. Perhaps situations like that would be better off with the longer-necked Norma Mag.
Rob Pincus
New member
Chucko,
The Hornady "Light Magnum" Line is simply, as you suggested, simply hot loaded ammo. I think they load (ed?) most popular non-magnum calibres in the their LM load. I have some of it in .308, .30-06 and .25-06 I think.
If anyone comes up with a definite source for the .308 Mag, Please post it here or Email me.
Thanks
The Hornady "Light Magnum" Line is simply, as you suggested, simply hot loaded ammo. I think they load (ed?) most popular non-magnum calibres in the their LM load. I have some of it in .308, .30-06 and .25-06 I think.
If anyone comes up with a definite source for the .308 Mag, Please post it here or Email me.
Thanks
The Sportsman's Guide lists Norma manufactured .308 Norma Mag ammo. 180 gr. sp m.v. 3018 fps m.e. 3642 ft.-lbs pretty spendy though $34.97/box of 20
They can be reached at www.sportsmansguide.com or 1-800-888-3006
A few years back a guy I know (who was not into guns and had never fired any centerfire rifle before) showed me a rifle his uncle had just given him (knowing I was into guns.) It was a very clean - 95% + old Winchester bolt action with a Weaver 4x scope chambered in .308 Norma mag. I offered to buy it, but he didn't want to sell. A couple of days later he came into work wearing his shades, when he finally took them off, he had 2 black eyes, a swollen nose, and stitchesfrom the top of his nose across his eyebrow. He told me that he had got into a fight with his old lady and she smacked him with a frying pan. I laughed and said "you shot that damn rifle didn't you?!" He replied "yeah ,but don't tell anybody, I'd rather have them think she did it." He still wouldn't sell it to me, and I don't think he ever tried to fire it again.
B
They can be reached at www.sportsmansguide.com or 1-800-888-3006
A few years back a guy I know (who was not into guns and had never fired any centerfire rifle before) showed me a rifle his uncle had just given him (knowing I was into guns.) It was a very clean - 95% + old Winchester bolt action with a Weaver 4x scope chambered in .308 Norma mag. I offered to buy it, but he didn't want to sell. A couple of days later he came into work wearing his shades, when he finally took them off, he had 2 black eyes, a swollen nose, and stitchesfrom the top of his nose across his eyebrow. He told me that he had got into a fight with his old lady and she smacked him with a frying pan. I laughed and said "you shot that damn rifle didn't you?!" He replied "yeah ,but don't tell anybody, I'd rather have them think she did it." He still wouldn't sell it to me, and I don't think he ever tried to fire it again.
B
I took a friend newly out of the Marines with me when I put the big variable on my Sendero. I initially had it a bit far back, and my poor friend was used to the measly recoil of an M16A2-- We ended up putting 3 butterflies on his brow, and should have gotten him stitches.
I load my 180's pretty hot...
I load my 180's pretty hot...
.308 Norma Mag brass. (www.huntingtons.com)
part number 27637A. $96.98 per 100 rounds.
Ph: (530) 534-1212.
They may not be the least expensive, but they have ALWAYS given me excellent service. They probably have the reloading dies for the cartridge too.
Speer reloading manual #13 has the data.
Paul B.
part number 27637A. $96.98 per 100 rounds.
Ph: (530) 534-1212.
They may not be the least expensive, but they have ALWAYS given me excellent service. They probably have the reloading dies for the cartridge too.
Speer reloading manual #13 has the data.
Paul B.