.30-06 Improved

T

Tinbucket

New member
This subject has been addressed many time over the years, hr and there.
Unfortunatley I didn't retain any of it.
A bolt gun in .30-06 expanded .30-03 length and shoulder shoved forward, longer leade too.
Brass was available in 03 length, which is bout 1/10 longer, I think.
Reason of course more velocity or a given bullet.
At 55,000 lbs or depending on how loads go 65,000 psi I would hope to get another 300 fps in 150 grain bullet maybe a bit more?
Doable?
Idea of course is simply a ream job and better performing firearm with right loads. There is no such thing as too much velocity just a limiting budget.
 
You can get 3100 fps with 150's and a 26-28"" barrel with standard 30-06 brass. I've hit 3050 with a max load from my 22" barrels but got best accuracy right at 3000 fps. I think that is fast enough.

The load data I've seen just isn't that much if any faster. If you can get good accuracy and shoot bullets designed to work at those speed it won't hurt anything. Most 300 WM will shoot 150's to 3300-3400 fps. Use a bullet designed to quickly expand and it might blow up at close range. But with the right bullet, or at extended range it'll work.


https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/30-06-springfield-ackley-improved/

It just isn't worth the trouble to me. But that is just personal preference, some folks do it and think it is great.
 
Little to be gained and much to be lost. You would lose the use of factory ammo. The 30-'06 is loaded to lower pressure than the 270 and 308 Winchester cartridges in deference to original specifications for the Springfield rifle. If you are using a modern bolt-gun that is also offered in higher pressure cartridges like 270 Winchester, and 7mm Remington Magnum, then it is entirely safe to load that 30-'06 to a similar pressure as the 270. Using optimal powders and bullet weights, the 30-'06 has the most to gain, safely, from judicious handloads, without altering the chamber. It's way too easy to say that you can get x-plus velocity with your wildcat over standard 30-'06, to justify what can be done. You could have got most of that velocity increase just from handloads alone, without the conversion. The 30-'06 Ackley Improved is noted as being a waste of time powder and money to gain nothing at all in velocity.* Not all of Ackley's experiments were so fruitless; the 257 Roberts AI was entirely worthwhile. The 30-'06 is a fabulous big-game cartridge, only made better with select components and reasonable handloads. Beyond that, there is nothing you can do to make it, "better".

* See "Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading, Rifle-Pistol Vol. II", 1973, 1975.
 
I don't know if 3,000 - 3,100 is a 30-06's sweet spot so I'm not sure it'd be worth the effort. There are already guns/cartridges on the market that can do what you want with a .150 grain bullet without having to resort to a wildcat.

Just my 2 cents.
 
A bolt gun in .30-06 expanded .30-03 length and shoulder shoved forward, longer leade too.
Click to expand...
That is not a simple 30-06 Improved. You are talking about a 30 Gibbs or similar wildcat. They had their heyday a few decades ago trying to match 300 Win Mag velocities, but the trouble in brass forming and load development pretty much killed those wildcats. The velocity gain claims were fantastic, but once chronographs and pressure testing equipment became more commonplace the claims were seen to be extravagant and pressures exorbitant. The 30 Gibbs gained about 250-300 fps over standard 30-06 loads at safe pressure levels.
 
In many cases, the "velocity gains" were simply the results of dangerously elevated pressures and sometimes simply BS claims (since very few chronographs were available to reloaders).
If you want a magnum, get a 300WM. If you really don't care what your face looks like, go with those "hot rocket" load recommendations.
 
I have few books on wildcats including 30 Gibbs and 30-06AI and all have loads and velocity. Non of the articles are written by Gibbs or Ackley's. The one that Bob Hagel did on the 30 Gibbs he mention the comparison to the 300 H&H and he has loads for 150gr @ 3200/3100fps. He also wrote about going higher and pressure problem.

When Speer did their Wildcat Manual 50's and used Ackley's loads for 30-06AI they did mention pressure problem.

Bob Hagel test rifle had 26" barrel and Speer 30-06AI also has 26" barrel.
 
You can jack the standard up, easily in a 24" barrel. I've hot loaded 150s to 3000, 165s to 2900, and 180s to 2800; but they weren't remotely accurate as 2900, 2800, and 2700, respectively. I would, however, recommend opening your throat up. Did that on a 6.5 and .338-06 and they push 140s to 2900 and 200s to 2810 with great ES and SD readings at the chrony.
 
You guy's got me here. 30-03 case? The designation for the 1903 Springfield was put there because it was first produced then. The 30-06 is the designation of the year the bullet weight was changed, the case wasn't changed that I'm aware of. The case in 03 and 06 have to be identical because the 03 could fire the rounds made after 06. The 03 to 06 had nothing to do with the case, only the bullet! If I remember right the 03 fired a 200/220 gr bullet and in 06 it was changed to a 150 gr bullet.

I would think to get a 30-06 Imp, you would simply blow out the case in an improved chamber.
 
Actually, the case length was shortened, but only in the neck. The 30-'03 and the 30-'06 have the same body dimensions. If you want to make 30-'03 cases that are correct for length, you can use 270 Winchester cases with the necks expanded to 30 caliber.
 
The .30-06 Improved isn't about the case length to get more capacity. It's about a different shoulder angle. The Improved is 40 degrees vs the 17 degrees 30 minutes of the '06.
Line drawings are here. http://stevespages.com/page8d.htm
"...case wasn't changed..." The '06's neck is shorter and the OAL is too. 2.494" vs 2.54". The '03 used a 220 grain RN vs the 150 grain Spitzer of the '06.
 
The 30-03 case is a fraction of an inch longer in the neck than the 30-06 case otherwise the dimensions are the same. You can shoot 30-06 ammo in a 30-03 but not the other way around.
Properly hand loaded to modern pressures the 30-06 is just fine as is.
Paul B.
 
For eons, the factory loadings for the '06 were around 49,000 to 50,000 psi. The .308 came out with a factory loading around 55,000 psi, which is the main reason for equal performance with 150-grain bullets.

The '06 is slightly over-bore, which is why it is "happier" with barrel lengths in the 24" to 26" lengths.

For some 30+ years my primary hunting rifle in '06 had a 26" barrel. My 150-grain handloads, at some 55,000 psi (approximately) provided a muzzle velocity near 3,150, give or take some 50 ft/sec. Typical groups all through the years were about 7/8 MOA.

Everything I've ever read about the AI version mostly figured it as ten percent more powder for five percent more velocity.

Personal opinion, yeah, but handloads in a 24" '06 make it pretty much as useful a hunting gun as an AI, a .300 H&H or a .300 Win Mag. I say this because most hunting kills are within 300 yards, and I know the '06 kills Bambi to 450 and 500 yards. (I have one 450-yard kill, and my father had three 500-yard kills in front of witnesses.)
 
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