.243 for Whitetails??
- Thread starter Fabrat
- Start date
The .243 is an OK whitetail cartridge, but I feel there are better choices available. I don't doubt the .243 is capable of taking deer cleanly, as I have killed deer with one in the past. However, bullet selection and shot placement are very important when using a smaller caliber like the .243. Nevertheless, as long as you use a well constructed 95-100 gr bullet, and you pick your shots accordingly, you won't have any problems at all. If it was me, though, I would lean towards a .260 or 7mm/08. I have seen several instances where a .243 was unable to penetrate both shoulders on a deer, whereas a heavier bullet possibly could have.
Jason makes some good points.
I have taken 6 deer & one antelope with the .243 - all bullets were handloaded 87 gr Hornady spitzer, except for the 'lope which was Sierra's 85 HPBT.
Every single critter never walked out of its footsteps. All shots were in excess of 300 yards & broadside, except the 'lope was a headshot.
I'd agree if you have to shoot through a shoulder that the .243 might be a tad on the light side, but with a 100 gr (Sierra's GameKing comes to mind), it should still do the trick.
Keep in mind that you don't have to shoot completely through a critter. The bullet detonating 1/2 way through will make 'em DRT.
My experience = the .243 is an outstanding deer round.
I have taken 6 deer & one antelope with the .243 - all bullets were handloaded 87 gr Hornady spitzer, except for the 'lope which was Sierra's 85 HPBT.
Every single critter never walked out of its footsteps. All shots were in excess of 300 yards & broadside, except the 'lope was a headshot.
I'd agree if you have to shoot through a shoulder that the .243 might be a tad on the light side, but with a 100 gr (Sierra's GameKing comes to mind), it should still do the trick.
Keep in mind that you don't have to shoot completely through a critter. The bullet detonating 1/2 way through will make 'em DRT.
My experience = the .243 is an outstanding deer round.
slick slidestop
New member
I hunted with one for about 18 years, up until last year when I decided it was time for more firepower (bought a 7MM mag).
I had been hunting in Del Rio for the last 5 years or so and my average shot was 250 yards away. I killed 2 deer per year in Del Rio (That's all I can eat in a year, so thats all I shoot) and it worked fine for all of those deer but one. I think the Heart/lung shot hole clotted up due to the very small hole as I had a great blood trail that just stopped suddenly with no more to be found. Thats when I decided to get a larger round. It was the first Deer I had ever lost in the 30 years I have hunted.
My suggestion is to get at least a 270 or larger for a little added security.
I had been hunting in Del Rio for the last 5 years or so and my average shot was 250 yards away. I killed 2 deer per year in Del Rio (That's all I can eat in a year, so thats all I shoot) and it worked fine for all of those deer but one. I think the Heart/lung shot hole clotted up due to the very small hole as I had a great blood trail that just stopped suddenly with no more to be found. Thats when I decided to get a larger round. It was the first Deer I had ever lost in the 30 years I have hunted.
My suggestion is to get at least a 270 or larger for a little added security.
"I think the Heart/lung shot hole clotted up ... "
Not to be too questioning, but a "heart/lung" shot usually drops stuff pretty darned toot-sweet in my experience.
Yup, I've had lung-shot elk run for 1/4 mile. & had "an experience" with a damnable doe deer with a .308 that defied any explanation .....
Anyway. Every .243-shot critter has died in their tracks & literally didn't take one step out of their footsteps other than a "jump" from the shot's impact.
However, I have had deer/elk shot, lung-shots, with .30-cal 165s/180s, etc. run off 100 yards - 1/4 mile before expiring.
I dunno & won't argue - just passing on the experiences I've had with .243 shots.
Everything (emphasis added) I've connected with the .243 has dropped in-it's-tracks. Can't say that for any other cartridge used - even on same-same game.
Not to be too questioning, but a "heart/lung" shot usually drops stuff pretty darned toot-sweet in my experience.
Yup, I've had lung-shot elk run for 1/4 mile. & had "an experience" with a damnable doe deer with a .308 that defied any explanation .....
Anyway. Every .243-shot critter has died in their tracks & literally didn't take one step out of their footsteps other than a "jump" from the shot's impact.
However, I have had deer/elk shot, lung-shots, with .30-cal 165s/180s, etc. run off 100 yards - 1/4 mile before expiring.
I dunno & won't argue - just passing on the experiences I've had with .243 shots.
Everything (emphasis added) I've connected with the .243 has dropped in-it's-tracks. Can't say that for any other cartridge used - even on same-same game.
Al Thompson
Staff Alumnus
Would the apparent hunting area being Maine make any difference? The deer get a tad bigger there.
Could be, Gizmo.
Still, a bullet only has to penetrate, what?, 8-10" , if that, & then "detonate" to do it's bizness.
I've yet to see a bullet "blow up" on initial penetration & the only meat loss I've seen on exiting was about a 1/4 pound (The Wife's latest (first) antelope) on the off-side shoulder. & that with a Nosler 120 Ballistic Tip (a fairly frangible bullet, all told). All my .243 shots were 300+ yards & none ever exited - maybe agood thing regards off-side meat loss ....
I dunno. I'm certainly no expert on the matter.
I've hunted a bit & taken some.
Just passing on what I've experienced.
Still, I've yet to see anything drop stuff right-the-F-now! than the .243 - within its game-size - all mine have been under the 150 lb-range, BTW.
Nothing I've used on deer drops 'em like the .243
Still, a bullet only has to penetrate, what?, 8-10" , if that, & then "detonate" to do it's bizness.
I've yet to see a bullet "blow up" on initial penetration & the only meat loss I've seen on exiting was about a 1/4 pound (The Wife's latest (first) antelope) on the off-side shoulder. & that with a Nosler 120 Ballistic Tip (a fairly frangible bullet, all told). All my .243 shots were 300+ yards & none ever exited - maybe agood thing regards off-side meat loss ....
I dunno. I'm certainly no expert on the matter.
I've hunted a bit & taken some.
Just passing on what I've experienced.
Still, I've yet to see anything drop stuff right-the-F-now! than the .243 - within its game-size - all mine have been under the 150 lb-range, BTW.
Nothing I've used on deer drops 'em like the .243
dairycreek
New member
The 243 is an excellent deer rifle!
I've used one for nearly 40 years and, when I did my job, the 243 certainly did its job. Have always tried for a "heart lung", head, or neck shot and each of those, when accomplished, are right now lethal. Recoil is very low which makes it a good choice for kids starting out and women who may be recoil sensitive. I hunt in Oregon where coastal blacktail deer tend to be somewhat smaller than the mule deer found in eastern Oregon. Size made no difference as long as bullet placement was effect. Excellent choice IMHO. Good shooting
I've used one for nearly 40 years and, when I did my job, the 243 certainly did its job. Have always tried for a "heart lung", head, or neck shot and each of those, when accomplished, are right now lethal. Recoil is very low which makes it a good choice for kids starting out and women who may be recoil sensitive. I hunt in Oregon where coastal blacktail deer tend to be somewhat smaller than the mule deer found in eastern Oregon. Size made no difference as long as bullet placement was effect. Excellent choice IMHO. Good shooting
the one deer i've seen whacked w/ a 243 was a complete penetration, completely lost deer.
bullet exited, and the hit was believed to be good (due to the huge amount of pink blood and 'stuff' on the offside), but the deer ran, and was tracked for about 6 hours...never recovered (blood trail disappeared).
i guess my point is, since you are getting a new rifle, and they all cost the same within a mfgr, why stop at the 243? my personal min. would be a 25-06...if it is a short action you are after and aren't interested in recoil, check out the 7-08, 260, and 308. anyway, i'd look to 257 cal. and larger.
don't go to the absurd side, though, and feel like you need an 8mm or 338 on up...stay between 257 and 308, and there's not a bad choice.
bullet exited, and the hit was believed to be good (due to the huge amount of pink blood and 'stuff' on the offside), but the deer ran, and was tracked for about 6 hours...never recovered (blood trail disappeared).
i guess my point is, since you are getting a new rifle, and they all cost the same within a mfgr, why stop at the 243? my personal min. would be a 25-06...if it is a short action you are after and aren't interested in recoil, check out the 7-08, 260, and 308. anyway, i'd look to 257 cal. and larger.
don't go to the absurd side, though, and feel like you need an 8mm or 338 on up...stay between 257 and 308, and there's not a bad choice.
Took a half dozen whitetail and mule deer with the .243 - had one non-recovered that still haunts me to this day. Went to heavier calibers since then - presently, the 6.5's (.264) seem to work well for me.
Seems most of the shooting in Maine would be 100 yds or less, which means the big blasting, long range cartridges would not be necessary. For short action rifles such as the .243, you have a wonderful choice of .257 Roberts, .260 Remington, 6.5mmx55 Swede, 7-08, .308, to name a few. Any of these, including the old and venerable Thutty-Thutty would be just fine.
Seems most of the shooting in Maine would be 100 yds or less, which means the big blasting, long range cartridges would not be necessary. For short action rifles such as the .243, you have a wonderful choice of .257 Roberts, .260 Remington, 6.5mmx55 Swede, 7-08, .308, to name a few. Any of these, including the old and venerable Thutty-Thutty would be just fine.
Go .308-class if you want. The Wife uses a 7-08 & I do too for stuff bigger.
It will kill 'em.
I have & did a white tail doe, perhaps a whole 120 lbs, once with a .308 Win Nosler 165 gr Ballistic Tips.
She took the initial hit & ran off. I tracked her through over 1 mile & tagged her again, & again, till a final 5-yard hit amongst a covey of flushing whitetails .... five good hits with a .308 Win Ballistic Tips ....
Whatever - I've hunted deer for well over 40 years & taken a few. I've shot a couple with .308 Barnes X bullets & they've all run 100 yards +.
Everything I have ever shot with a .243 have died imediately in their tracks.
Everything has died immediately in its tracks with a .243 - I can't say that with any other rifle cartridge.
Again, I'm not spouting anything .243 - I don't hold a patent or anything else.
Onliest thing I know is that every deer-sized game I've ever shot with a .243 died immediately in its tracks.
It will kill 'em.
I have & did a white tail doe, perhaps a whole 120 lbs, once with a .308 Win Nosler 165 gr Ballistic Tips.
She took the initial hit & ran off. I tracked her through over 1 mile & tagged her again, & again, till a final 5-yard hit amongst a covey of flushing whitetails .... five good hits with a .308 Win Ballistic Tips ....
Whatever - I've hunted deer for well over 40 years & taken a few. I've shot a couple with .308 Barnes X bullets & they've all run 100 yards +.
Everything I have ever shot with a .243 have died imediately in their tracks.
Everything has died immediately in its tracks with a .243 - I can't say that with any other rifle cartridge.
Again, I'm not spouting anything .243 - I don't hold a patent or anything else.
Onliest thing I know is that every deer-sized game I've ever shot with a .243 died immediately in its tracks.
slick slidestop
New member
labgrade,
Since I could not locate the deer, I can only make the assumption that it was a heart/lung as that is where I aimed. Yeah, I know about assumptions ...LOL
There was a good splatter with a couple of chunks of tissue. Then he evidently stopped before jumping a fence as there was about a 1 foot diameter thick puddle of bright arterial type blood.
On the other side of the fence a couple of drops....then NOTHING.
It was amazing, almost like he vanished . Remember this is Del Rio, not much grass, mostly rocks, mesquite, ceder and cactus. Five of us spent a couple of hours canvassing the area and couldn't find it.
Since there was sooo much blood on the ground and then it stopped, I figured either tissue or a clot plugged the hole long enough for him to get far enough away to loose the track.
I have killed probably at least 40 deer with that 243, so I am not knocking the round, I think at the distances I am shooting at now (250 + yards) a larger caliber is warranted.(That and I needed an excuse to buy another rifle
)
Since I could not locate the deer, I can only make the assumption that it was a heart/lung as that is where I aimed. Yeah, I know about assumptions ...LOL
There was a good splatter with a couple of chunks of tissue. Then he evidently stopped before jumping a fence as there was about a 1 foot diameter thick puddle of bright arterial type blood.
On the other side of the fence a couple of drops....then NOTHING.
It was amazing, almost like he vanished . Remember this is Del Rio, not much grass, mostly rocks, mesquite, ceder and cactus. Five of us spent a couple of hours canvassing the area and couldn't find it.
Since there was sooo much blood on the ground and then it stopped, I figured either tissue or a clot plugged the hole long enough for him to get far enough away to loose the track.
I have killed probably at least 40 deer with that 243, so I am not knocking the round, I think at the distances I am shooting at now (250 + yards) a larger caliber is warranted.(That and I needed an excuse to buy another rifle
)Art Eatman
Staff in Memoriam
And another happy-face for the .243! I've done in maybeso 20 deer with mine. All but one were with the Sierra 85-grain HPBT; mostly neck shots.
Just generalizing, I don't think a 7mm08 is much more recoil, and it does deliver a bit heavier bullet. My guess is a bit more "wiggle room" on larger deer.
My thinking is that if you're real close to positive about the shot, a .243 is plenty good for a lot of stuff. My opinion is that the more powerful cartridges, in the event of a bad hit, will temporarily "anchor" an animal a bit longer, giving more time to get a second shot in. That few seconds (opinion, remember) might make the difference between a kill and a lost critter.
But for sure, the .243 is a sweetheart of a cartridge.
Art
Just generalizing, I don't think a 7mm08 is much more recoil, and it does deliver a bit heavier bullet. My guess is a bit more "wiggle room" on larger deer.
My thinking is that if you're real close to positive about the shot, a .243 is plenty good for a lot of stuff. My opinion is that the more powerful cartridges, in the event of a bad hit, will temporarily "anchor" an animal a bit longer, giving more time to get a second shot in. That few seconds (opinion, remember) might make the difference between a kill and a lost critter.
But for sure, the .243 is a sweetheart of a cartridge.
Art
richhelton84
New member
.243 isn't too bad of a choice, but I wouldn't use anything less than a .270. If you're buying a new gun, I would recommend looking at a Remington Model 710. They come in either .270 or 30-06, and they only cost a little over $400. I've even seen them in South Carolina for $375. They come with a Bushnell Sharpshooter scope as well.
Rich
Rich
Legionnaire
New member
My son has a Model 7 in .243, and he's four for four since he started hunting with me four years ago. I think its a fine cartridge, plenty for deer with a good, 100gr controlled expansion bullet.
I disagree with Rich on the 710, though. Do a search in the archives for discussions of this rifle. My conclusion is that it is an adequate rifle for the guy who shoots less than a box of ammo a year and who, after taking his deer, cleans the rifle and puts it away until next season. If you're a shooter, I think you'd be better off with a Remington 700 ADL and a Leupold or Burris 4X scope. My $.02.
I disagree with Rich on the 710, though. Do a search in the archives for discussions of this rifle. My conclusion is that it is an adequate rifle for the guy who shoots less than a box of ammo a year and who, after taking his deer, cleans the rifle and puts it away until next season. If you're a shooter, I think you'd be better off with a Remington 700 ADL and a Leupold or Burris 4X scope. My $.02.
Thanks for all the responses.... I thought the .243 would be plenty of cartridge but have had a few dissenting opinions from a few friends. As for the rifle.. won't be a Remington 710. Might be a 700 ADL or a Browning A-Bolt Medallion. Any opinions on the Browning? I don't see mant posts on that particular rifle. The deer " way up here in Maine " are not giants but are likely larger than those in the more temperate regions. I have yet to shoot a deer at any range greater than 100 yards . Just can't see that far through the woods. Most shots will be less than 75 yards with a typical range around 50. I can never figure out who is more surprised -- me or the deer. I still hunt and stand hunt ( depending on the weather ) and have been equally successful with both methods. Once again , thanks for the opinions.
Fabrat
Fabrat
Mannlicher
New member
I have killed deer in Florida, and Virginia with the .243. I never lost one, or had to trail one far.
I can say the same about the deer I have shot with my Mannlicher .270, the Mannlicher 8X57, several 30/06, 7mm/o8, 7mm Mauser Ackley Improved, .250 Savage Ackley Improved, and of course the lil carbines, .44 Mag Marlin and the old Marlin 30/30.
I dont think it is really the cartridge or load, so long as the chosen one is reasonable. I am committed to the thought that it the range you hunt at, and bullet placement more than anything else, that determines success.
I can say the same about the deer I have shot with my Mannlicher .270, the Mannlicher 8X57, several 30/06, 7mm/o8, 7mm Mauser Ackley Improved, .250 Savage Ackley Improved, and of course the lil carbines, .44 Mag Marlin and the old Marlin 30/30.
I dont think it is really the cartridge or load, so long as the chosen one is reasonable. I am committed to the thought that it the range you hunt at, and bullet placement more than anything else, that determines success.
richhelton84
New member
FABRAT, where in Maine do you live? I lived in York for 5 years (long time ago) when my dear old dad was in the Coast Guard.
A lot of guys I went to high school in York with hunted with Garands, and Winchester/Marlin lever actions. I used an old Marlin 30/30 lever myself.
Rich
A lot of guys I went to high school in York with hunted with Garands, and Winchester/Marlin lever actions. I used an old Marlin 30/30 lever myself.
Rich
Jumping back in after a coupla days elk-scouting & generally freezing our butts off for a day or so. (whah - beats "town" though )
One thing about the .243 is that I'd suspect you'd want a longish barrel, ~22-24" to acheive the velocity that seems to zap 'em. Maybe not though, based on Legionnaire's accounts. Dunno barrel length on his son's - some of the later M7s had a bit longer barrels than ours (18.5")
Mine's a standard length (.243, never measured - Dad bought it way back & I shot it - who cared?) but 22-24" or so - right in there anyway & the velocities for 85-87s are well over 3000fps & even 100gr'ers would be right in there. Seems to be an outstanding blend of bullet fragmentation WITH (no question) placement.
Dad used 130s in his .270 & I saw deer run well over 100 yards, I've shot 'em through the lungs/heart with Barnes X Bullets in a .308 & watched 'em run over 100 yards. Same-same with .30-06 & etc. I'd suspect a .25-06 would drop 'em in their tracks merely due to the "added" velocity that seems to make that special difference.
Though too. The Wife smoked an antelope last weekend with a Rem M7 7-08, a Nosler 120 Ballistic Tip at a mere 2600 fps (chrono'd handload). 325 yards, right over the top of the heart, quartering & took out both lungs. Thing took 3 half-staggering-steps & dropped.
Not quite as good performance as I'm used to with a .243, but plenty close enough.
Beats me, guys. I only report what I've seen & try not to lie too much (even though I do fish here 'n there ... )
Everything I've shot, or seen shot, with a .243 drops in its tracks - granted proper placement (& the .243 trajectory allows this with some pretty good freedom) & these have been 300+ to 400 yard deer/antelope shots.
Everything. Never walked out of its tracks. DRT, within 10 feet, or less.
I've seen 'em hit with much "better," but never dropped on the the spot like with a .243
& that's all I know.
)One thing about the .243 is that I'd suspect you'd want a longish barrel, ~22-24" to acheive the velocity that seems to zap 'em. Maybe not though, based on Legionnaire's accounts. Dunno barrel length on his son's - some of the later M7s had a bit longer barrels than ours (18.5")
Mine's a standard length (.243, never measured - Dad bought it way back & I shot it - who cared?) but 22-24" or so - right in there anyway & the velocities for 85-87s are well over 3000fps & even 100gr'ers would be right in there. Seems to be an outstanding blend of bullet fragmentation WITH (no question) placement.
Dad used 130s in his .270 & I saw deer run well over 100 yards, I've shot 'em through the lungs/heart with Barnes X Bullets in a .308 & watched 'em run over 100 yards. Same-same with .30-06 & etc. I'd suspect a .25-06 would drop 'em in their tracks merely due to the "added" velocity that seems to make that special difference.
Though too. The Wife smoked an antelope last weekend with a Rem M7 7-08, a Nosler 120 Ballistic Tip at a mere 2600 fps (chrono'd handload). 325 yards, right over the top of the heart, quartering & took out both lungs. Thing took 3 half-staggering-steps & dropped.
Not quite as good performance as I'm used to with a .243, but plenty close enough.
Beats me, guys. I only report what I've seen & try not to lie too much (even though I do fish here 'n there ...
)Everything I've shot, or seen shot, with a .243 drops in its tracks - granted proper placement (& the .243 trajectory allows this with some pretty good freedom) & these have been 300+ to 400 yard deer/antelope shots.
Everything. Never walked out of its tracks. DRT, within 10 feet, or less.
I've seen 'em hit with much "better," but never dropped on the the spot like with a .243
& that's all I know.
i guess my experience differs...
i'm not denying that the 243 is adequate for deer...i have no doubt about its effectiveness on antelope. the only deer i've seen drop at the shot were the ones i dumped w/ my 7mm mag. lesser cartridges (defined as smaller bullet diameter, less energy) have failed to leave me w/ the same results (which includes 243, 25-06, 220, and 223).
my argument is not if the 243 is a viable deer round, but rather, why use a 243 if you are buying a new rifle and it costs the same? the 7-08, 308, 284, 260, etc would all be better... why stop at adequate?
if you already have a 243, then i am not advocating getting rid of it in favor of a bigger cartridge...
maybe a lot of it has to do w/ placement...when i let the rifle buck, i shoot just behind the shoulder; the only bones i hit are ribs. this generally results in double lung hits and substantial exits. sometimes the heart is completely disintegrated.
maybe a lot of the people who advocate the 243 (and smaller) for deer are, in fact, making cns hits (too risky for me to rely on - i prefer the big target of the heart/lungs)?
anyway, i'm not a big supporter of the 243 for deer. maybe that speaks more for the way i hunt (shot selection). i've only ever taken one cns shot (buck was at a severe downward angle, walking away at about 40 yards), and 1 shoulder shot (mulie on top of a rock outcropping at about 225 yards), and the rest have been double lung (from 8 feet - 485 yards).
on the rem 710...you are not likely to find a bigger remington supporter than i...however, i will be the first to say that the 710 is not even an adequate gun for the 1-box of shells/year hunter. this disgrace to rifles should be avoided, and hopefully rem. will discontinue it. it is ugly to boot.
i'm not denying that the 243 is adequate for deer...i have no doubt about its effectiveness on antelope. the only deer i've seen drop at the shot were the ones i dumped w/ my 7mm mag. lesser cartridges (defined as smaller bullet diameter, less energy) have failed to leave me w/ the same results (which includes 243, 25-06, 220, and 223).
my argument is not if the 243 is a viable deer round, but rather, why use a 243 if you are buying a new rifle and it costs the same? the 7-08, 308, 284, 260, etc would all be better... why stop at adequate?
if you already have a 243, then i am not advocating getting rid of it in favor of a bigger cartridge...
maybe a lot of it has to do w/ placement...when i let the rifle buck, i shoot just behind the shoulder; the only bones i hit are ribs. this generally results in double lung hits and substantial exits. sometimes the heart is completely disintegrated.
maybe a lot of the people who advocate the 243 (and smaller) for deer are, in fact, making cns hits (too risky for me to rely on - i prefer the big target of the heart/lungs)?
anyway, i'm not a big supporter of the 243 for deer. maybe that speaks more for the way i hunt (shot selection). i've only ever taken one cns shot (buck was at a severe downward angle, walking away at about 40 yards), and 1 shoulder shot (mulie on top of a rock outcropping at about 225 yards), and the rest have been double lung (from 8 feet - 485 yards).
on the rem 710...you are not likely to find a bigger remington supporter than i...however, i will be the first to say that the 710 is not even an adequate gun for the 1-box of shells/year hunter. this disgrace to rifles should be avoided, and hopefully rem. will discontinue it. it is ugly to boot.