.223 for hunting whitetail
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DiscoRacing
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Not legal in some states... it IS here tho.... am actually thinking about using mine next year with 69 grain bullets.
I think a lot depends on what whitetails you are talking about. If we are talking about big, heavy bodied western deer at frequently long ranges then the answer would be no.
However, for our 110lb Florida deer at an average 100 yds or less then it is quite adequate (not ideal but it gets the job done).
However, for our 110lb Florida deer at an average 100 yds or less then it is quite adequate (not ideal but it gets the job done).
semi_problomatic
New member
Its illegal in some states, as being inhumane...and yet the military uses it for assaut rifles and the 249 squad automatic weapon with a maximum effective range of 600 meters for killing people... interesting, isn't it? Personally I wouldn't use it for deer. I've seen what it does to people and its really not an effective round. I prefer the .30 cal rounds because they have enough weight for punching through thin brush and thump.... but then again I just shoot steel targets now.
trooper3385
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In my opinion, in the hands of an experienced hunter that can place the shot where it needs to be within reasonable ranges, it's adequate. Not something that I would want to give to an inexperienced hunter. It's all about shot placement, but you don't have near the room for error as you do with a larger caliber.
Art Eatman
Staff in Memoriam
Military usage is irrelevant. The military doesn't need to consider "clean, ethical kills with minimal suffering" as part of the equation. Hunters are required to do so.
As far as using a .223 on Bambi, I figure three things: First, the shooter's skill at hitting a specific place on a deer, not just "somewhere in the brown". Next, the ability to control one's adrenalin such that the first is possible. Last, using a bullet of modern design that is less likely to blow up on a rib and make a surface wound which is fatal but allows a deer to escape and suffer.
But I wouldn't select a .223 for my deer hunting. I definitely want a bit more power, with the .243 as one example.
As far as using a .223 on Bambi, I figure three things: First, the shooter's skill at hitting a specific place on a deer, not just "somewhere in the brown". Next, the ability to control one's adrenalin such that the first is possible. Last, using a bullet of modern design that is less likely to blow up on a rib and make a surface wound which is fatal but allows a deer to escape and suffer.
But I wouldn't select a .223 for my deer hunting. I definitely want a bit more power, with the .243 as one example.
I'm kind of IFie on the 223 for hunting. Meaning I dont know. (Yeah that makes since).
First, Wyoming dosn't allow the 223 for hunting big game. Regardless I never considered it. I think (or am guessing) this was based on the 223 using 55 grn bullets. Then I agee, its too light.
BUT: They have bigger bullets now days. 77-90 or so. For deer hunting I use the 90-100 grn bullets in a 257 Rbts or 243. They work great. So why wouldnt the 80 grn 223??? I guess Game & Fish Depts might figure if they say you can use 223s you'd have people out there with 40 gr 223 bullets.
You cant legislate agaist stupid so I guesss I'd have to side with our Fish and Game.
In reality its a non-issue for me, I'm not giving up my M-70 Featherweight in 257.
First, Wyoming dosn't allow the 223 for hunting big game. Regardless I never considered it. I think (or am guessing) this was based on the 223 using 55 grn bullets. Then I agee, its too light.
BUT: They have bigger bullets now days. 77-90 or so. For deer hunting I use the 90-100 grn bullets in a 257 Rbts or 243. They work great. So why wouldnt the 80 grn 223??? I guess Game & Fish Depts might figure if they say you can use 223s you'd have people out there with 40 gr 223 bullets.
You cant legislate agaist stupid so I guesss I'd have to side with our Fish and Game.
In reality its a non-issue for me, I'm not giving up my M-70 Featherweight in 257.
FrankenMauser
New member
It's not my first choice, but can be used responsibly.
However, I chose "Underpowered". It isn't due to lack of power in the cartridge, but lack of proper bullets being used for the job. Even "good" hunters seem to make poor bullet choices with the .223.
With a proper bullet, it can do the job; but the likelihood of fragmentation on a rib, or complete, explosive expansion are higher.
With every compromise, comes limitations.
However, I chose "Underpowered". It isn't due to lack of power in the cartridge, but lack of proper bullets being used for the job. Even "good" hunters seem to make poor bullet choices with the .223.
With a proper bullet, it can do the job; but the likelihood of fragmentation on a rib, or complete, explosive expansion are higher.
With every compromise, comes limitations.
hillbillyshooter
New member
It'll do it. Some on here won't like this statement but I have taken a deer with a Mini14 4x fixed scope firing 62 grain soft-tip ammo. Heart shot with minimal rib interference. Maybe lucky but it did it.
Major Dave (retired)
New member
Semi problomatic
My understanding of the military using .223 on people, is not that it kills efficiently, and not that it is a close combat "Man stopper", but that it is:
light weight (compared to 30-06 and 7.62 NATO)
compact - soldiers can carry larger quantities in smaller magazines
less recoil - muzzle doesn't climb as much during full auto
economical - less lead, less brass,ammo production costs are less
wounds without killing - requires 2 uninjured combatants to leave the battlefield to take care of each wounded. Then, many initially wounded die anyway, but created a burden on enemy resources, depleting medical supplies.
I'm sure that the Small Arms Weapons Board, at Fort Benning Georgia, home of the Infantry took ALL of these factors into consideration in the pre-Vietnam era. The 2 tours I pulled in RVN proved they were right about the design, in all aspects.
The .223 was not designed for whitetail hunting. It is what it is - an infantry round - in the original FMJ configuration.
My understanding of the military using .223 on people, is not that it kills efficiently, and not that it is a close combat "Man stopper", but that it is:
light weight (compared to 30-06 and 7.62 NATO)
compact - soldiers can carry larger quantities in smaller magazines
less recoil - muzzle doesn't climb as much during full auto
economical - less lead, less brass,ammo production costs are less
wounds without killing - requires 2 uninjured combatants to leave the battlefield to take care of each wounded. Then, many initially wounded die anyway, but created a burden on enemy resources, depleting medical supplies.
I'm sure that the Small Arms Weapons Board, at Fort Benning Georgia, home of the Infantry took ALL of these factors into consideration in the pre-Vietnam era. The 2 tours I pulled in RVN proved they were right about the design, in all aspects.
The .223 was not designed for whitetail hunting. It is what it is - an infantry round - in the original FMJ configuration.
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Go Major Dave
Did some time myself and that's exactly why they use it. Takes allot of people to take care of a wounded man. Dead men don't need much.
The earlier post that stated shot placement is the key. Many people shoot only once a year during deer season. Not very accurate with their weapon. I guess why some states will not allow it. here in Ga. you can use a screwdriver if you want
Did some time myself and that's exactly why they use it. Takes allot of people to take care of a wounded man. Dead men don't need much.
The earlier post that stated shot placement is the key. Many people shoot only once a year during deer season. Not very accurate with their weapon. I guess why some states will not allow it. here in Ga. you can use a screwdriver if you want
I think it depends on your location (ie. size of deer). For our little whitetails around here it works, I've taken many of whitetail and a couple of antelope with 62gr soft points outta my Mini-14. With a .223 you have to pick your shots wisely, know your ability and know your rifle.
I have no doubts my .223 will kill deer, but I have so many better choices in my safe there isn't even any need to consider it. .243/6mm is the smallest legal caliber in Colorado and in a .243 Win or 6mm Rem it packs quite a bit more energy than the .223 can muster. I have no need to hunt deer with a .223 which is a fine coyote rifle IMO.
chevelle383
New member
My father in law shot a mule deer in northern ID with a .223. Hit it in the heart and said it made a mess of everything. Said his 7mm never made that much of a mess. BUt I didnt see it with my own eyes so...
I said decent. But "I think" only at closer ranges like under 100 yards. My step-dad took 4 deer this year with a .204. 2 neck shots drt. 1 in the boiler room drt devastating hole. These shots were within 100 yards. The 4th deer was about 200 yards away he had to shoot it twice. I don't really agree with using the .204 but it is putting meat in his freezer.
.243 is the smallest I'd go.
I couldn't really use a .22 caliber anything for deer. But I hunted with a friend who used one and only took neck shots and he never had a problem.
What if you see a trophy at 200 yds and now you only have the .223. How many would take the shot anyway? For those that don't do you feel unprepared? Which would drive me nuts.
If your in position where you only have access to a .223 then so be it. You use what you got. If it's a money thing where its the best you can afford to buy and shoot, again so be it. But if your looking for a rifle to buy and afford it or have access to something a little bigger then thats what I'd go with.
Why potentially put yourself in a bad position.
I couldn't really use a .22 caliber anything for deer. But I hunted with a friend who used one and only took neck shots and he never had a problem.
What if you see a trophy at 200 yds and now you only have the .223. How many would take the shot anyway? For those that don't do you feel unprepared? Which would drive me nuts.
If your in position where you only have access to a .223 then so be it. You use what you got. If it's a money thing where its the best you can afford to buy and shoot, again so be it. But if your looking for a rifle to buy and afford it or have access to something a little bigger then thats what I'd go with.
Why potentially put yourself in a bad position.
MikeRussell
New member
well, it depends...
For some of the WMAs around here and does (in S. Louisiana), a .223 with a well placed shot is good. Especially when coupled with an excellent shooting AR platform (makes it light and easy to get through the swamps/palmettos/thickets). HOWEVER, there are some WMAs and other areas that have some fairly large bucks (largest so far on the WMA that I hunt was 255lbs this year) which require a lil more oooomph.
I wouldn't hesitate to use it on a spike or doe in these areas, but for the larger deer I prefer not to go with less than a .243 or 6.8spc. I lugged around my big, heavy .308 through the thick areas because I procrastinated too long on my 6.8spc AR upper build (and I put off getting that HR Handirifle in .45-70). While, I do have a much lighter .243, I chose the .308 to make sure if I ran across a larger brute in the thick stuff that I'd enough oooomph to get him for sure.
For some of the WMAs around here and does (in S. Louisiana), a .223 with a well placed shot is good. Especially when coupled with an excellent shooting AR platform (makes it light and easy to get through the swamps/palmettos/thickets). HOWEVER, there are some WMAs and other areas that have some fairly large bucks (largest so far on the WMA that I hunt was 255lbs this year) which require a lil more oooomph.
I wouldn't hesitate to use it on a spike or doe in these areas, but for the larger deer I prefer not to go with less than a .243 or 6.8spc. I lugged around my big, heavy .308 through the thick areas because I procrastinated too long on my 6.8spc AR upper build (and I put off getting that HR Handirifle in .45-70). While, I do have a much lighter .243, I chose the .308 to make sure if I ran across a larger brute in the thick stuff that I'd enough oooomph to get him for sure.
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