.223 bullet choice 1 in 12 twist

F

fariaguard

Inactive
I purchased a Ruger M77 MKII in .223 with a 1 in 12 twist in 2004 and have put around 200 rounds through it (55 FMJ).

I put NECG peep sight on it and is has been "soda can MOA" at 100 yards but now I want to mount an optic and wring out it's accuracy potential. Back in the day I was ignorant of twist rate vs. bullet length or I would have purchased something else with a faster twist.

What factory ammo -bullet weight - length would you suggest for accuracy? The heaviest (heavier is usually longer) would you recommend?

Are 60 - 62 - 65grs out of the question? I need advice before spending money on ammo that others would not recommend. I will be reloading my own soon.
Thanks!
 
Your 1:12 twist is made to shoot 40 grain to 50 grain bullets a lot more accurately than the longer grain bullets you would like to purchase, with 55 grain being the longest bullet your rifle may be able to stabilize reliably. After that it's a crap throw, only way to know is to try shooting several lengths or (grains) and see which bullet will give you your desired accuracy and distance that is suitable for you.
 
There have been numerous posters reporting sucess with 62gr and one even managing stability with a certain 69gr, not sure which.

All you can do is try out a few and see what happens.
 
62 grains

I've got a tidy bolt .223 from another maker, twisted 1-12, and have shot it with a variety of ammo, both factory and reloads. The little rifle has a 20" tube and is very portable and pleasant to shoot.

At 100 yds, it will shoot right around 1" to 1-1/4" often with 3 of the 5 hovering sub inch, with Remington 62 gr Match ammo. I use that ammo as a benchmark against my reloads. I have no idea how the stuff groups beyond 100, or how it will do in other rifles. I have also had 62 gr Federal Tactical (bonded) ammo do OK in the bolt rifle, shooting into about 1.5"+/-. That slug in not match quality, but is a bit stubby in shape, and I believe its short overall length allows it to stablize better in slow tiwist barrels. I dunno who makes the bonded slug for Federal. A third semi-hevi-weight that I have fooled with is the 60 gr Nosler Partition. I have not shot it in .223, but in a slow twist 22-250, and again, believe its stubby profile lets it do better than in should by conventional wisdom. Another slug that does well for me in reloads, and you may search for it in factory ammo, is the Sierra 52 or 53 gr Match King.

Simply put, you may have to do some shooting to see what your rifle likes. I mentioned the 62gr Remingtons & Federals, as that bullet weight/load works in my rifle. Conventional wisdom as advised by others previously is that the slow twist rifles do best with 50-55 grains slugs, and that is indeed where I would start.

Finally, I've found that .223 factory ammo quality is all over the map, even from the big name US makers. I attribute that to the incredibly high demand, what with political trends and the AR explosion in recent years. Particualrly obnoxious in the accuracy dept from my little sporter is "anybody's" 55gr FMJBT fodder. Also had some name brand 55 gr soft points that would not group worth a hoot, either in my bolt rifle, or the AR carbine.

Good luck with your project.
 
You need to find out what works with your rifle. My Savage model 25 is a 1 in 9" twist and does NOTshoot 62 gr well at all. It Does shoot most any 55 fmj into tiny groups.
Half the fun is trying
David
 
I have a well kept 35yr old 110E with a 3x9 Vari II that does very well with Winchester 64gr PowerPoint ammo. Easily under 3/4" for 5 shots at 100yds, I'm pretty sure it has a 1 in 12" twist.
 
I have a pair of HOWA .223 rifles(1 sporter 24" & 1 varmint 24")-both with 1-12 best I can tell. Both shoot 40-50 grains extremely well and 55 grains good enough. Neither will do better than 2" with Nosler or Hornady 60 grain SP and I didn't bother to try 64-69.
It is what it is and your Ruger has significant trade in value. If you're absolutely determined to shoot heavier bullets(IMHO a 55 grain bullet will do all that's reasonably expected of a .223 anyway), best make a trade.
 
I am getting 1/2 MOA with factory loaded 50 grain Fiocci polymer tip ammo from 1 / 12 twist CZ 527 Varmint. The accuracy falls off to 1+ MOA with the same vendor 55 grain bullets. Stable is one thing, optimal is another.

A 1/2 moa, for me means my average 5 shot center to center groups at 100 yards is 0.5 inch.

Note, the new CZ are 1/9 to satisfy popular mythology. The varmint guys will have to turn to the 204 or 222 from CZ.

The 1/12 is OPTIMAL for varmint hunting with varmint bullets. This is NOT for the AR forum. When someone says "what you want" , ... well what do you want? If it is making small critters dead within the range limitations imposed on that size target with a 1/2 MOA rifle then 1/12 is the best. And 45 to 50 grain bullets most likely where you are going to find the love.

Be grateful (to the OP) you have a very practical fire arm for paper punching with the right load or making small critters, very dead, very fast. I hope you got a good Ruger.
 
Scoping it will not make it shoot better with that or any other load. If you plan on shooting factory you need to try a box of as many brands as you can to find the ammo your rifle shoots best. The price of it means nothing.
"...it's accuracy potential..." That indicates target shooting vs hunting? Most match ammo uses 69 grains or heavier bullets. Probably won't shoot well with a 1 in 12, but try it anyway. Midway, assuming mail order isn't out of the question, has Nosler 60 grain BT match ammo on sale at $19.79 per 20. Might be worth looking into.
 
Win 64g power points and Sierra 63g semipts work well out of 1/12 and even 1/14 .223s ime. Basically the shorter stubbier bullets in heavier weights work best in the slower twists.
 
Some load 52 grain match ammo. I dont know about the quality. But, since the op does not want to waste money then may I suggest one box at a time. And, Please, try Fiocci 50gr PT. Start lighter rather than heavy. I suspect good quality hunting ammo is as good or better than most of the so-called match ammo. Words on a box.... proof is in the shooting.

Are you honestly planing to shoot beyond 300 yards? Not 300, over 300? Shooting a 12" steel plate at 500, is not like paper at 100,200,300. I have to be honest and plead ignorance on the long distance shooting sports. Speculation ... It has got to be quite a leap from 100 yard soda cans to 500 yard steel. You may not have made the bad choice you seem to think.

For a scope, think about higher magnification such as 6-18x, I like the Leupold VxII with the adjustable objective and fine cross hair in 6-18x.. But you can go way way up or down the dollar scale. Nikon has some nice optics for the price. I find once I pass beyond 12x, the lower cost scopes begin to suffer more severely. Well, unless you got some sport in mind needing the mil dots.

The Leupold scopes are generally lighter for a given magnification. It is a nice price and quality point for a better grade Ruger. Again, hoping for the best on that particular gun. You never go wrong with good optics - even if you dump the rifle.

You might be surprise to learn, some of the best barrel makers and suppliers of AR uppers offer stainless 24" varmint barrels in 223 with a 12 twist. For the minority who use the AR for serious varmint work. Not to worry about shooting 105 grain bullets or tracer rounds - yes, you miss the boat on that one for sure. Everything in rifle shooting is a balance and trade off. No free lunch and just pushing one parameter is never without some consequence. For that matter a 24" bull barrel on an AR, has to be a miserable brute to setup.

I wonder how ruger cut the chambers on their 223? The CZ has a dual chamber which will accommodate the 556. That hurts the 223 accuracy potential with excessive free bore. The fast twisters, often claim due capability. Nice if you want it, another trade off to suffer for the varmint shooter. Perhaps the ruger is a 223 only barrel?
 
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Twist rate and velocity go hand-in-hand. It's a balancing act.
All else being equal in getting an optimal bullet rpm, as one increases, the other decreases. (Higher velocities can use slower twist rates; and faster twist rates make up for lower velocities.)

So, if you have a long barrel (20-24") on that 77 Mk II, it may make up somewhat for the 'slow' twist rate.
On the other hand, if it's a compact model (16-18"), you're pretty much stuck in the land of light weight bullets.


I'd say give some 62/63 gr bullets a chance. See how they shoot, and go from there. That's likely to be the top end of what the barrel will like.

But, it's not a huge deal if that turns out to be the case. There are some very good bullets in the 50-55 gr range, whether you want to shoot paper or animals.
 
I took 52 gr bullets out to 600 yds on a few occasions but the wind will definately push the 52's around. I generally shoot 52's at my clubs 200 meter range. I tried 69's in my 1-12" Savage but not a good choice. The 69's shot ok, but I only got about 2 MOA at 200 meters.
 
When I shot 68 and 69 gr bullets through a 1:12 twist 20" barrel, several hit the paper target sideways. Handloads and a longer barrel might stabilize but at the 100 yards mentioned in the OP, 50-52 match or varmint bullets might be a better starting place.

A scope will not increase the inherent accuracy of a barrel/ammo combination, but it sure makes it easier to put the POI on the same spot every time.
 
Reviving this thread in hopes that I can add to the usable info.

My Howa 1500 .223 Rem likes 60 gr. Sierra Varminters best, over 22.7 gr. of H322. This combo, with the bullet .020" off the lands gives me sub MOA all day (when I participate accordingly) at 100 yds, even in a mild wind. Tried 69 gr., but I could never get it to group like the 60 gr. did. As far as I can see, 100 yds. is the optimal range for this caliber.
 
Scoping it will not make it shoot better with that or any other load.
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Correct, but it will let the OP shoot better.

If it were my rifle I'd stay with 55 gr bullets. If you want accuracy get away from the FMJ bullets and go with a good plastic, soft point tip or HP by a known manufacturer like Hornady, Nosler or Black Hills.

Ugh! This was from last year.
 
joed wrote:
Ugh! This was from last year.
Click to expand...

Yes. As you could have read in post #17, jhansman said he was reviving the post. And since this whole question could be resolved with a Google search in less time than it takes to post a thread, but people continuously ask it anyway, it's as opportune a time to point them to the on-line resources that answer their question - and implicitly respond to people who post artificially narrow weight ranges without explanation as if it was something they received on a holy mountain.
 
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