1911 10mm, six loads chronographed

R

roklok

New member
Spent some time today with my 5 inch Kimber TLEII 10mm and a chronograph, shot two factory loads and 4 handloads, thought some here would be interested in the data. First, I am not recommending any of the following handloading data ! Do your own research, work your own loads up, do not assume that the loads listed here are safe in your gun or any gun for that matter. You know the drill.

Averages shown are of five shots each

1st load, HPR factory load, 180 grain XTP, average 1248.5 FPS

2nd load DoubleTap factory 200 grain Hardcast , average 1299.8 FPS

3rd load Handload, 10.5 gr Blue Dot 180 grain XTP, average 1285.8 FPS

4th load Handload 11 gr Blue Dot 180 grain XTP, average 1368.8

5th load Handload 10 gr 800x 180 grain XTP, average 1399 FPS

6th load Handload 10.5 gr 800x 180 grain XTP, average 1470.6 FPS

I was pleased that the Double Tap factory 200 grain hardcast load was right on the listed velocity on the box (1300 FPS out of a 5 inch barrel) I have read a lot of complaints lately about DT's 10mm loads not meeting advertised velocities, but this load at least in my gun is spot on with claimed velocity.

Again, I listed the handloads to put the velocities in context. DO NOT assume this data is safe in your gun. The Kimber has a fully supported chamber, unlike a lot of 10mms out there. I also am using a square bottom FPS, 25 pound mainspring, and 20 pound recoil spring.
 
Thanks for doing that testing & chrono work.
Good to see that recent 10mm ammo from DT vets to the advertised velocity.
Still have a batch of their early 10mm 165gn Golden Saber ammo and it consistently met the claimed velocity.
 
Thanks for posting this information. I'm a long time fan of the 10MM and have shot, reloaded and chronographed the 10MM since the Bren Ten days. The loads you chronogrphed are what I consider the "real" 10MM, as opposed to some of the 10MM Lite ammo that is not much more than .40 S&W...
 
out of my S&W 325 short barrel .45 ACP Buffalo Bore plus P auto rim shoots 200 grainers at 1200 plus on my Oehler 35P ... just noting...
 
I know little about 10mm, but that 6th load seems insanely overcharged when I consulted my Lyman manual. 180 gr JHP 800x 8.4 1073fps max.

Or am I missing something?
 
I know little about 10mm, but that 6th load seems insanely overcharged when I consulted my Lyman manual. 180 gr JHP 800x 8.4 1073fps max.

Or am I missing something?
Click to expand...
Actually, IMO: it's both
First off, I have the 47th and 49th Lyman manuals and in my experience looking up many, many, many loads in both, it seems like the Lyman manual offers max loads that seem to be start loads elsewhere. I doubt this is true for each and every load across the board, but in my findings, it is more than a slight trend. Witness the velocity output of a 180gr slug from a 10mm in the load you references from the Lyman manual: 1,083 FPS. That's almost two hundred feet per second slower than true 10mm.

Next is the powder, IMR-800X.
Quite possibly the worst metering handgun powder in the history of handloading. For quite a long time, Hodgdon listed a max load that was well under the potential of this powder in 10mm, and it was evidence by the very sedate max pressure they listed with their max load. I never asked them about it -- those who publish loads go to great lengths to test the things they elect to publish and they do it in a lab environment. It certainly could be that they found some anomalies they did not like at heavier loadings, so they backed it off.

Or it could be that they also realize that 800X meters just tragically, and given the variance of a typical powder dump of the stuff, they kept it low to safeguard poor handling of it?

In any case, when the serious 10mm handloaders began exploring the potential of the round, they found that 800X did a miraculous job of squeezing velocity out of the 10mm and they worked up loads that satisfied them. And then they built boutique ammo companies out of those loads.

If you look up Hodgdon's data for 800X in 10mm with a 180 grain slug, you'll see an 8.7gr max load... returning just 30,000 PSI -- for a cartridge with a SAAMI max pressure rating of 37,500 PSI.

Do DoubleTap and Underwood have pressure testing equipment and do they shake their loads out in a lab? I have no idea. But advanced handloaders who push the 10mm don't stop at 8.7gr of 800X with a 180 grain bullet. ;)
 
You gotta love that 800x. You gotta weigh it, too! Blue Dot is some good medicine for my Delta. That was a good point about keeping the springs current.
 
I was pleased that the Double Tap factory 200 grain hardcast load was right on the listed velocity on the box (1300 FPS out of a 5 inch barrel) I have read a lot of complaints lately about DT's 10mm loads not meeting advertised velocities, but this load at least in my gun is spot on with claimed velocity.
Click to expand...

I have found the same with my G-20. The average was 1305 fps IIRC. Almost exactly what they report from the same gun.
 
The 10.5 grains of 800X behind a 180 XTP is a HOT load. A bit too hot for my liking, but I believe it to be safe in MY gun with new brass. The primers were flat, but the primer pockets were not loose, new primers seated fine. I decided not to use that load in the interest of not beating the pistol to death. I have actually seen higher charges of 800x listed on some popular loading databases. I settled on a load that is averaging 1370 FPS with the 180 XTP, with 750 ft lbs of energy.

All my 800X loads are individually weighed. Again, I am not recommending any of the above data, and am well aware that it exceeds a lot of published data in the major loading books.
 
Maybe you have a spicy lot of 800x and Blue Dot because looking back over my notes for when I used to load for the 10mm, from a 4.6" G20 I got:

180gr XTP, 10.5gr 800x @ 1.250" (CCI LP): 1,363 fps AVG
180gr FMJ, 10.8gr Blue Dot @ 1.255" (Win LP): 1,244 fps AVG

You're loads are showing ~100-120 fps higher from a slightly longer 5" bbl. Could be anything I guess, but anyways with such a big difference it makes me think there could be chrono issues or something.
 
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