10mm safety announcement

[Mr.RevolverGuy]

DON’T MAKE 10MM SOMETHING IT IS NOT
First I am a big 10MM fan, the 10MM is one of my favorite cartridges. I am forever grateful to the likes of Jeff Cooper, Tom Dornaus and Mike Dixon. Without these gentlemen the 10MM would not be in existence today. As odd as it may seem the 10MM’s power was almost the cause of it’s demise. Though over the past 8 years we have seen a huge resurgence in it’s popularity. I have even seen Millennial’s and Gen Z’ers gravitating towards 10MM, what I thought was the old people round. And there you have the reason for this service announcement.

10MM FAN CLUB DON’T KICK ME OUT YET
Here lately I have been seeing more and more accidents with 10MM. Every single one of these accidents were driven by those fascinated by 10MM power. If it is reading online, watching video’s or seeing it live. It all begins with statements like, 41Magnum power in a semi-auto, I can reload 10MM to 44Magnum power. AND FRANKLY neither of these are true. Now hold on before anyone get’s their feelings hurt. Can you reach 41Magnum and 44Magnum foot-pounds of pressure? SURE YOU CAN. Is it wise and safe for you and others around you? NO IT IS NOT.

44Magnum can go from mild to wild even with book loads if you are a handloader, generating 500 to 1500 foot-pounds of energy safely. 10MM tops at 750 foot-pounds safely.

What most do not understand is that, yes, you are getting 41 and 44 Magnum foot-pound-like energies, but they are truly the lower end of what those calibers are capable of.

SO WHAT CAN THE 10MM DO?
In the circles of these comparisons, you often hear Bear or Bear Country discussed. I am not sure where the majority of the 10MM fan club resides but I am not in that part of the country where I will run into a bear. Which often leads me to thinking someone must be preparing for a hunt in bear country. In either of these scenarios I always advocate practice with what you are most proficient with. For me that regimen means practicing with the premium ammo that I plan to carry with. This allows me to have maximum confidence in my complete outfit, ammo, revolver or pistol. This is where 10MM begins to shine. At current prices premium 44Magnum ammo with the Xtreme Penetrator freedom pill is $65 a box of 20. 10MM Ammo from the same company with the Xtreme Penetrator is $38 a box of 20.

Can you use cheaper practice ammo sure you can but I want to make sure I am as proficient as I can be with what I carry when my life is dependent upon it. Not to mention you are most likely to practice with something that is cheaper and easier to shoot. Full 44Magnum energy in a packable package is not fun to truly practice with over hundreds of rounds.

Other 10MM Benefits

Fast
Accurate
Higher Magazine Capacity
Easier to Master
Less Painful to Shoot
I know some will argue reloading assist with the cost and this is true. But even I, after reloading for 30 years will not carry my own loads in this bear type of situation. Can I load them to a velocity to replicate like energy for practice sure I can.

RELOADING 10MM
Do you have to color outside the lines, go over reloading manual recommendations to achieve some of the same performance that the premium 10MM manufacturers do like Buffalo Bore?

Simply answered NO YOU DO NOT. There are a few critical things I feel you must know when reloading for 10MM. This cartridge at it’s origins is already high pressure round. First get yourself the right components 180gr to 200gr are my go to loads in 10MM for anything.

Yes there are 220gr rounds being produced but I have seen too many failure to feed in many different pistols. Many are going to blame the pistol but my experience says differently as cartridge overall length is probably the most important function to feeding. It is most important to safety as well because reducing case volume increases pressure. Now if you plan to carry a revolver and want the 220gr loads ROCK ON they are absolutely capable. Though I would recommend getting a Sheridan Engineering 10MM case gauge. These gauges are cut to replicate minimal chamber specifications. If your round will fit in this gauge it will work in your well maintained pistol or revolver.

If you truly are after four legged critter protection in your own handloads lean towards powder that burns on the slower side. BE-86, BlueDot, Accurate #9, CFE Pistol and Power Pistol all fit this application. Trying to achieve maximum velocity with faster burning powders will surely cause a mishap. If you want to use W231, Titegroup and other faster burning powders for range fodder please keep them on the lower end of the powder charges. Again you must pay very close attention to the cartridge overall length. Loading with these faster burning powders and shortening the overall length is a recipe for disaster due to the initial spike in pressure when ignited. For the reloader you can measure the case web before the shot is fired and after to see the difference, expansion in the case.

If you would like a deeper view of factory ammo and handloads that have been chronographed for Dayattherange visit the 10MM Loading Depot.

This data is not intended to replace the appropriate reloading manuals data and should not be used without verifying and double checking the loads between two different official published reference points — IE reloading manuals. If you elect to utilize any of this data it is at your own risk, you take full ownership and responsibility for your ammunition.



THE 10MM OFFERS SO MUCH
The 10MM has so much to offer and it is great bear defense medicine. In a semi-auto it gives you more capacity/chances to hit a charging bear. This is a highly stressful situation where one is most likely to miss. 10MM in semi-auto I find easier and faster to deploy out of a holster and if you have that opportunity easier to reload if needed.

10MM with factory or handloading can be used in a wide range of scenarios. With the right components can remain safe with book loads or what most of us reloaders call watered down lawyer loads. Though there are some reloading manuals out there that will give you true 10MM loads with slower powders. Like the one I used in the making of this video.

In this video I attempt to see if my own safe handloads could generate the same type of performance as Buffalo Bore 180gr. I do not know of anyone well educated about these rounds that would debate their capability in any situation.

https://youtu.be/9zY_PTbAkPE

Original article with more pictures that would not post here https://dayattherange.com/?p=12847

 

[sparkyv]

Nice writeup on the 10mm cartridge, Mr. RG. But I'm curious why after with all of your reloading experience that you would not trust your hanfloads afield. Can you provide some insight?

 

[totaldla]

First, the 10mm is a 357mag equivalent.

Second, the Extreme Penetrator doesn't. Hardcast or jacketed flat nose are what to use for big bear.

Third, if you have to modify your pistol to get boutique ammo to function reliably, you've messed up.

Lastly, I carry a 44mag revolver. I read the bear defense stats and know that bears haven't figured out how to evolve past the 44mag - it works just fine.

 

[rc]

While the 454 Casull certainly has a lot more oomph, I would agree a hit with a 44mag or even a 357 mag or 10mm is better than a miss with a 454!

 

[disseminator]

There is no room in the 10mm for +P loads IMO. It is already a very high pressure cartridge and the brass ejects violently from my G20. I would not want to push it beyond established limits myself.

I have a nice load for the 200g Nosler at 1200 FPS that is near maximum and very accurate. I have also loaded the 200 and 230g hard-cast from Doubletap and there were some feeding issues with them but were otherwise OK.

If you need more power and want a big flat bullet, the 44 mag in where it's at.

I love 44 Special +P hand-loads that will crush the 10mm, but are still low pressure in the 25k range. Also, no feeding issues and WAY more bullet availability. You can also load 44 Russian +P and it will equal or exceed 10mm with less pressure and you can use the same powders as your 10mm loads.

Very versatile that 44 Magnum is. I also load for 41 magnum, and I have never understood claims that the 10mm is equal to it. No way.

OP, your points are well made and loaders should take heed.

 

[bamaranger]

10mm

My first 10mm was a G20 acquired in the mid 90's. I've loaded for the cartridge since. Originally interested in the ctg as the ultimate SD round, I've since adopted it as a hunting cartridge for whitetails. Couple of years ago, I acquired a RIA 1911, and (don't laugh) a Hi-Point carbine, also in 10mm and load for it as well.

My loads are from published manuals and I use 2400 powder, as I try and keep it on hand for magnum handgun cartridges. Not ideal, but it works for me and it is published (in an older RCBS manual) . I run standard LP primers. For projectile I settled on 180 gr JHP, the XTP. I recently acquired a quantity of lead 200 gr bullets. The plan is to run them as a midrange practice load at just over 1000 fps.

The only time I got on thin ice with the 10mm was using Unique as a propellant for a full power load, as 2400 had become hard to locate. My Unique load seemed satisfactory, and then I changed primers, again because primers were hard to locate. From one brand to another, not from STD to MAG., just brand. We all know that changing components, you should reduce and work back up. I did not. I'd not had any pressure signs, and my velocities from the Glock were not all that impressive. No big deal right......wrong.

First clue was excessive blast and hyper ejection. Examining spent cases, some displayed the infamous Glock "bulge". The primer change had effected the burn rate of the charge of Unique, and I was lucky. Lesson learned. I also stopped using Unique in 10mm....or for any full power load for that matter.

 

[bamaranger]

more

Checking my notes, I see that velocities w/ 180-200 gr bullets from the G20 OEM bbl 4.6"m max loads NEVER reached the max velocities claimed in my manuals. To get the velocities claimed in the manuals, or by others, from the OEM G20 would require exceeding published max charges....... in my pistol. The 6" Lone Wolf barrel in the G20 boosted velocities 50-75 fps using 2400. The 16" barreled Hi-Point boosts velocity 100fps, welcome, ....but I expected more.

Blue Dot was a disappoint in both my 10mm handguns. Max charges of Blue Dot did not reach the same velocities that max loads of 2400 did, and 2400 filled the cases better and ES/SD was better as well. I loaded the pound of Blue Dot I purchased, but will not buy more (as long as I have 2400 on hand). That's seems odd, as Blue Dot seems highly regarded in 10mm and 2400 is not.

Just a bit of shooting with the lead 200 gr truncated bullets, supposedly hard cast, seem to indicate that I can drive the lead bullets faster with less powder. A drop of 2.5 grains from max (2400) still easily yields velocities exceeding 1000 fps in the RIA/1911, with a whole lot less fuss. I shouldn't be surprised by that, as it has been my experience with revolvers as well, but I did not expect that I could drop over 2 grains. I have not benched those loads for accuracy or POI. The 1911 has fixed sights.

Hot rodding the 10mm is the result of ammo companies loading the ctg down and the chatter about having to reload the 10mm up to reach full potential.
That is certainly true, one can improve on many factory loads, but I agree that the velocities being claimed by some folks exceeds what I am willing to attempt in my guns.

 

[stagpanther]

Bama--I still have a couple of the early Glock 20's which I bought during my 10mm infatuation period and they were briefly the only game in town (one being converted to 9 x 25 dillon even). I still have one of the OEM barrels which--if your's is like mine--came with polygonal rifling and the infamous exposed case head in the barrel shroud. IIRC; Glock expressly warned against using cast bullets in it. I too replaced the barrel--as well as the mainsprings and triggers in an effort to hot-rod it.

 

[Unclenick]

I think a lot of hot-rodding mistakes come from an incomplete understanding of the relationship between pressure, gas quantity, and muzzle velocity. Many suppose that when the 10 mm achieves the same peak pressure as a 41 Mag, it should match 41 Mag velocities for the same barrel length and thus match its muzzle energy with same-weight bullets. What this thinking ignores is that the 10 mm Auto case is shorter than the 41 Magnum case, and when seating depth is considered, the powder space is proportionally shorter still. This means a smaller charge of a given powder, like 2400, will be needed to reach 41 Mag matching pressure in the 10 mm, but a smaller charge doesn't make as much total gas. So, pressure drops off faster as expansion continues while the bullet goes down the bore after the pressure peak. For this reason, further bullet acceleration post-peak pressure is lower than you get from the larger charge used to reach the same pressure in the Magnum case. Add to this that many revolver barrels, when you add in the chamber length, are longer than many pistol barrels, and you have further reason for matching 41 Mag performance is not in the cards for the 10 mm.

 

[stagpanther]

I never aimed for anything beyond the original Bren 10 specs. I won't swear by it--but I seem to recall two things happened that "watered down" the 10mm to 40S&W--LE determined the original Bren was too much to handle for officers--and then when the Bren went under the Delta Elite started getting cracked frames so ammunition was "watered down" even further.

 

[bamaranger]

motivated

I lack the motivation just now to list my velocities from:
-G20, 4.6 OEM & 6" Lone Wolf
-RiA 1911 5" full size
-HI Point carbine 16"

Will do in near future....probably

 

[jmr40]

I didn't see this addressed. If I missed it, I apologize. But some of the loads you show in the chart are most likely overloads with jacketed bullets. But probably not with hardcast bullets.

I don't load for 10mm. But I do have some of the 200 gr loads for 10mm made by Buffalo Bore and Double Tap that are in the 1250-1300 fps range. I have no concerns about their safety.

 

[Nathan]

All of these rounds and loads effect one’s ability to be effective at higher velocity and energy levels.

Effectiveness for simplicity is shot to shot time plus the ballistic effectiveness of each round. So, while you may get buffalo bore max power ammo, how fast can you shoot those? Then consider people want to put this stuff in a 329 or 69…I’m gonna be like 1 shot every 3s from those!

In 10mm, I could be faster, but not with “nuclear “ level loads!

I prefer my 1150-1200fps 44 mag loads in a 5” 629. I can hit and still shoot pretty fast!

 

[bamaranger]

fast?

So tactical these days......I use the 10mm as an auto pistol hunting cartridge. If I shoot well, one and done, Bambi has never shot back, even when I missed. I suppose rate of fire could matter on hogs or furry threats.

Here's a listing of velocities I'm obtaining with 2400 powder and max loads from Speer Manual #13, 5 rd average:

180 gr jacketed truncated flat point bulk purchase
G20, 4.6' OEM barrel.......... 1225
6" Lone Wolf...............1275
RIA 5" 1911 GI...................1205fps
16" HiPoint carbine..............1355

180gr Hornady XTP JHP
G20 OEM............................1154 fps

200gr XTP
G20 OEM............................1110fps BLue dot.....1094 fps

200gr Lead, Badman Bullets, mid range/practice, 2.6 gr reduced from max
RIA 1911............................1050fps

These (excluding the lead load) are serious loads, but not nuclear. None exceed published max in the old Speer manual. The 180TP from the RIA 1911 killed a mature whitetail this past winter at 17 yds, bullet clipping the spine forward of the front shoulder, lacerating the top forward edge of the heart, and breaking the off side upper leg bone, where it was recovered. Weight retention 98% . DRT.

 

[Mr.RevolverGuy]

Way to go bamaranger

 

[Webleymkv]

I'd tend to agree that 10mm is somewhat misunderstood and, increasingly, pressed into roles for which it is not particularly well-suited. The notion that 10mm is basically the semi-auto equivalent of .357 Magnum is pretty accurate as, with true top-end loads in both, you can get roughly the same velocities with roughly the same bullet weights. They're also, IMHO, useful for the same tasks such as personal protection and hunting for up to deer sized game. Both, however, are a bit on the light side for animals like Grizzly Bear and, if pressed into that role, are best used with non-expanding bullets.

The idea that 10mm is equal to .41 Magnum is, IMHO, erroneous. I think a lot of that comes from comparing the Winchester Silvertip loadings of both which both featured 175 gr bullets at very similar advertised velocities (10mm's advertised velocity was actually slightly higher IIRC). What is left out of this comparison is that the Silvertip was a rather lightly loaded .41 Magnum and the 10mm Silvertip almost never reached its advertised velocity in a real gun (usually falling about 100 fps short).

I find the 10mm to be most useful with bullets in the 155-180 gr range which, oddly enough, have similar cross-sectional densities as 125-158 gr .357 bullets which are, IMHO, the most useful weights in that caliber. While 200 gr bullets do have certain uses in 10mm, like 180 gr bullets in .357 Magnum, you're really pushing the limits of the cartridge to get them up to useful velocities. Bullets heavier than 200 gr are, IMHO, a waste of time as you have to either strain the pressure limits of the cartridge more than I'm comfortable with doing or settle for velocities so low that you've basically turned it into a .45 ACP.

A 155 gr 10mm can be pushed to 1400 fps with several powder and load data combinations that can be found in current manuals and, IMHO, makes an excellent anti-personnel loading not all that dissimilar to a .357 Magnum with a 125 gr JHP at similar velocity. Likewise a 180 gr bullet at 1200 fps, like a 158 gr .357 Magnum at similar velocity, makes a very nice "general purpose" loading that's useful for both anti-personnel and hunting of up to deer-sized game. Both of these bullet weights can be driven about 100 fps faster if one wants to "push the envelope" but I really don't see the need.