10mm and 800X NOT loader friendly !

R

Road_Clam

New member
Dam, 800X just plain sucks. First off i'm observing a LOT of wildly varying load data between Lyman's 49th, Hornady's 9th and Hodgton. Even more confusing is Hodgton doesn't list a starting load, but calls out a max load of 8.7 for my 180 gr bullets ? Furthermore this powder does NOT meter at all through my Dillon 650's powder drop. I'm trying to load a target weight of 9g of 800X and i'm getting between 8.8 up to 9.6 ?? I really wanted to buy AA#7 or #9 but both my LGS's were out of these powders. Loading up all my test loads with my RCBS Chargemaster and got things dropping nice and consistent but jeez, loading pistol old skool' single stage is hard work as compared to loading on a 650 progressive ! I've done a lot of research over the past week attempting to load for my new Kimber 10mm Target II which has a 6" bbl so I want to err on the side of cautious as 800X can be a fussy powder from 'net feedback.
 
I have bought exactly one pound of 800X.
I'll never buy another....it would be the LAST powder I would buy in another shortage/ panic situation.

Its metering ability is legendary. <Legendarily BAD>
 
800X works well in the 44 Mag for less than full power loads. Haven't tried it in anything else. Meters about like Unique.
 
I tried 800X in 44 Mag with 260 gr cast bullets. All loads were weighed and trickled, so I know the powder charge was on the money.

The chronograph told me to put this powder away.

ES was well over 100 fps.

Accuracy was non-existent.
 
Meters about like Unique.
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That's characterizing it kindly, from what I understand.

Covering trampled ground here: 800X is notoriously poor metering. I was told (and shown) this very early in my loading days. I'm thankful I've never wasted my time/money on the stuff. Unique is bad enough.
 
I have several loads and bullet profiles to test. I loaned out my Alpha Chrony and finally got it back. . Can't use my Magnetospeed V3 on a 1911. Curious to see my data. Definitely a love/hate following for 800X (more towards hate).
 
9 grains of 800X is over max for a 180 grain bullet. Do not exceed published Max loads.
"...Hodgton doesn't list a starting load..." Hodgdon will tell you to reduce by 10% for the start load. That'd be 7.8 of 800X for a 180.
"...loading pistol old skool' single stage is hard work..." Using a single stage press quickly is about technique. Primarily using both hands.
Lotta powders don't flow through progressive mounted powder throwers well.
 
800X meters very poorly at low volume. It is a shotgun powder. In shot shell it meters just fine as measures are wider so it does not bridge to the sides.

If hand weighed it works pretty darn well. Blue Dot is much the same way. I have to hand weigh Blue Dot charges. With 180 grain JHP it gives good accuracy. Though the loads are not soft shooting. I used some AA7 yesterday. While not the same accuracy as Blue Dot. It metered much better. So it sped up the loading process, and the change in accuracy if I am standing up shooting as normal I would not notice a change.

For the 800x either hand weigh each charge. Or find a person that loads shot shells, and gift it to them.
 
800x is wonderful for certain loads. Compressed, full power loads in 357sig, for example. “Full power” 10mm loads are great too. Beyond current load data though, most of which equates 10mm and .40SW.
Meters just like every other powder for me... out of an RCBS Chargemaster 1500. ;)
 
Dufus said:
I tried 800X in 44 Mag with 260 gr cast bullets. All loads were weighed and trickled, so I know the powder charge was on the money.

The chronograph told me to put this powder away.

ES was well over 100 fps.

Accuracy was non-existent.
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You sir are spot on per my data I observed today via my Alpha Chrony. However I did surprisingly observe good (not great) groupings despite huge ES's.

Some of my data :

Berry's 180 / 9gr / 800X Low=1194 / High=1284 / avg=1233 / ES=90 / SD=34
*normal looking flatness on the primer

Berry's 180 / 9.2gr / 800X Low=1236 / High=1338 / avg=1299 / ES=102 / SD=40
*slightly flat primers, slight cratering firing pin strike

Berry's 180 / 10gr / 800X low=1348 / High=1414 / avg=1369 es=65 sd=20
*high pressures, heavily flattened primers.

Luckily the Kimber barrels have excellent support around the total circumference of the casing so I saw no casing deformation. WAY too much elevated ES's for my comfort level. Weighed all my loads on my RCBS CM 1500 so it's not the charge.
 
The reason Hartmut Broemel gives for 800X and the SR powders not being in the QuickLOAD database is the characteristic curves he's gotten from measuring them in a vivacity bomb are too inconsistent for him to provide a model he is confident of. He believes the source manufacturers have changed too many times and the lots have therefore differed unacceptably. I have some 800X I bought 25 years ago that I've never used because of the discouraging reports I got from friends after making the purchase, so I never bothered. If I developed loads with it now, I would not be at all confident they could be replicated once my can was empty (old DuPont can). It will probably wind up fertilizing the lawn at some point.
 
Found a good thread that illustrates my conflicting load data dillema, i'm not alone . Good info from the guys over at 10mm-firearms.com :

http://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-...10mm-older-hornady-manuals/msg79876/#msg79876

https://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-10mm-ammo/discussion-with-hodgdon-about-800-x/

Unclenick said:
I have some 800X I bought 25 years ago that I've never used because of the discouraging reports I got from friends after making the purchase, so I never bothered. If I developed loads with it now, I would not be at all confident they could be replicated once my can was empty (old DuPont can). It will probably wind up fertilizing the lawn at some point.
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Let me know if you need another pound and a half of 800x dirt fertilizer.
 
T. O'Heir said:
9 grains of 800X is over max for a 180 grain bullet. Do not exceed published Max loads.
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T. O'Heir have ALL your facts gathered before preaching. My Hornady's 9th manual lists the 10mm 180 gr bullet with 800x starting charge of 6.7gr (950 fps) and max is 10.1gr (1250 fps) .
 
John D said:
in my experience, Blue Dot provides the best load for 10mm
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I'm reading that either AA#9 or Blue Dot are the go-to powders for max loadings with the heavier 180+ gr bullets. I'm unfortunately having a hard time finding these powders locally.
 
I have not used AA9 in 10mm as of yet. I have used Blue Dot, and AA7. Both work very well with 180 grain bullets. For ease of use I will go with AA7 as it meters well from a volumetric measure. Blue Dot does not. It is larger flake, and shot shell measures are wider so it does not bridge in them the way it does in a standard measure.
 
m&p45acp10+1 said:
I have not used AA9 in 10mm as of yet. I have used Blue Dot, and AA7. Both work very well with 180 grain bullets. For ease of use I will go with AA7 as it meters well from a volumetric measure. Blue Dot does not. It is larger flake, and shot shell measures are wider so it does not bridge in them the way it does in a standard measure.
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I've tried for severall weeks to find AA#9 locally but no luck. I'll let you know how it works as I just got a great promo deal from Brownells and bought an 8# jug of AA9. It's a good fit for me as I load 357 mag, 44 mag, and 460 mag. AA9 will be a multi use powder for me, so a good investment.
 
AA9 is awesome for a more powerful magnum load. It is about as versatile 2400 and is much cleaner. You can run it with cast lead which is a big reason I like it so much in .357 Mag, and .41 Mag. It worked well in .30 Carbine as well. (I run H110 for that as all of the rounds are jacketed, and I am not expecting bug hole groups from it.) I still have some Power Pistol to try for it as well. The AA7 seems to work well, and the rounds with 180 grain JHP is anything but anemic.

Blue Dot works great as long as I use my automatic powder dispenser. It is much more slow going to load.
 
I've never, NEVER, had metering success with 800x....RCBS Uniflow, Lee Load all, 3 Dillon's (all smoothed out with 600 grit Wet or Dry). Variations with that SOB 800X can be up to 1/2 grain and believe me, I've tried every technique I've read to get consistency.

It's a a no-go...and I'd like to use it, dribbling it into .40 S&W and .32 H&R have given me my finest accuracy in a cpl of guns...but it's just not worth the frustration. I've used WSF as a replacement as well as Acc#7. Good luck, Rod
 
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