4runnerman
New member
I also would like to know what Sunday afternoon snipers are?. Most matches I go to are on Saturday's
5K for rifle, how to proceed
- Thread starter Madball6
- Start date
Txhillbilly
New member
A $5000 budget can get you a great set-up. You can go several directions with this.
1. Buy a full custom built precision rifle,and wait for it to get built. That will eat up a good chunk of your budget,so you might have to spend less on optics.
2. Buy a good production rifle,and then upgrade the barrel,stock,trigger,etc.. Then top it with with whatever optics you want.
3.Buy an Action,and build the complete rifle yourself if you have the mechanical ability and knowledge. This is what I prefer to do.
I've become pretty partial to the 6.5mm cartridges in the last several years. I bought a 260 Remington AR,and built a 6.5 Creedmoor & 6.5-06 bolt action rifles.My 308,30-06 & 300 WM don't see much range time anymore.
1. Buy a full custom built precision rifle,and wait for it to get built. That will eat up a good chunk of your budget,so you might have to spend less on optics.
2. Buy a good production rifle,and then upgrade the barrel,stock,trigger,etc.. Then top it with with whatever optics you want.
3.Buy an Action,and build the complete rifle yourself if you have the mechanical ability and knowledge. This is what I prefer to do.
I've become pretty partial to the 6.5mm cartridges in the last several years. I bought a 260 Remington AR,and built a 6.5 Creedmoor & 6.5-06 bolt action rifles.My 308,30-06 & 300 WM don't see much range time anymore.
johnwilliamson062
Moderator
Aren't thing like stock fit and type somewhat personal taste? I can't imagine dropping $5000 on a custom rifle for my first purchase. I would want to buy something less expensive and upgrade it as I figured out what I liked.
In attending shooting events I've noticed people tend to be not that willing to let someone who shows up empty handed handle their weapons. If you show up with something on the low end and show you know how to handle it, some will let you handle or even take a few shots with their guns.
I'm talking about competitions and not random people at a public range of course.
In attending shooting events I've noticed people tend to be not that willing to let someone who shows up empty handed handle their weapons. If you show up with something on the low end and show you know how to handle it, some will let you handle or even take a few shots with their guns.
I'm talking about competitions and not random people at a public range of course.
One of the best aspects of joining a gun club is the warm fellowship you gain between shooters. I've been asked to try probably 20 different firearms over the past 2 years, most all of my shooting buddies weather it be a $200 Mosin 91/30 or a $7000 GAP are always willing and even offer to let you try their sticks. This was how I came to choose my Bell & Carelson A5 stock , i was able to try one from a buddy. Then after that I had no problem dropping $450 on a stock knowing it was exactly what I wanted. This is also how I came to shoot my first Barrett 50 cal was through a club member. A 50 cal is one of those guns that you can't wait to try for the first time , then you immediately give it back and say "nope , never gonna' own one off these cannons" 
LOL
LOLMost accurate rifle I had cost me $501. Got it from the CMP Auction Site.
Its a Model 70 Target Rifle build by the Army Marksmanship Unit. It was listed as missing parts. It was, it was missing two screws which I had.
Its in 308 Win.
My intention was to build a 260 or 6.5 CM. That idea changed when I started shooting it.
Yeah its 308, but I've been shooting 308s a long time in High Power and my best 1000 yards scores were with the 308 in my Super Match M1A, so I can live with the 308.
The rifle has a clip guide and scope mount. So I can use it in HP or Precision Rifle matches.
$5000 - 500 leaves me 4500 for ammo to learn to shoot this rifle. A can buy a heck of a lot of reloading components for$4500.
Shot a Precision Rifle Match earlier this month. Screwed up three stages because I was a whole revolution off on the scope elev. knob. Other then that the rifle shot great.
Its not how much you pay. Its not the hardware, (rifle/scope, etc.) its the soft ware, the shooter, learning to adjust for environmental conditions.
I will admit, in the above mentioned PR match I cheated. I used the G7 range finder. I ranged the target and it told me how much to come up for each target, it automatically adjusted for Temp, Alt, Humidity, Angle, and wind (after I determined the wind speed and direction.
If I was going to spend $5 Grand on a rifle, a huge majority of that money would be spent on ammo components and bullets down range.
However, if you just want to spend the money for a truly custom rifle, by all means go for it. I have a lot of nice rifles.
But if you are only concerned about a shooter. Concentrate on ammo down range learning how to shoot it instead of just spending money on a rifle.
Its a Model 70 Target Rifle build by the Army Marksmanship Unit. It was listed as missing parts. It was, it was missing two screws which I had.
Its in 308 Win.
My intention was to build a 260 or 6.5 CM. That idea changed when I started shooting it.
Yeah its 308, but I've been shooting 308s a long time in High Power and my best 1000 yards scores were with the 308 in my Super Match M1A, so I can live with the 308.
The rifle has a clip guide and scope mount. So I can use it in HP or Precision Rifle matches.
$5000 - 500 leaves me 4500 for ammo to learn to shoot this rifle. A can buy a heck of a lot of reloading components for$4500.
Shot a Precision Rifle Match earlier this month. Screwed up three stages because I was a whole revolution off on the scope elev. knob. Other then that the rifle shot great.
Its not how much you pay. Its not the hardware, (rifle/scope, etc.) its the soft ware, the shooter, learning to adjust for environmental conditions.
I will admit, in the above mentioned PR match I cheated. I used the G7 range finder. I ranged the target and it told me how much to come up for each target, it automatically adjusted for Temp, Alt, Humidity, Angle, and wind (after I determined the wind speed and direction.
If I was going to spend $5 Grand on a rifle, a huge majority of that money would be spent on ammo components and bullets down range.
However, if you just want to spend the money for a truly custom rifle, by all means go for it. I have a lot of nice rifles.
But if you are only concerned about a shooter. Concentrate on ammo down range learning how to shoot it instead of just spending money on a rifle.
I'll chime in. As someone who has dumped 2500$ into a factory remington setup and about to drop 2300$ on a Custom GAP Tempest barreled action, i'd say i've been where the OP is.
To answer up front about SAC, Madball they're good to go. Mark does phenomenal work. I wouldn't hesitate with going with him. Matter of fact, Mark at SAC, George at GAP, Chad at LRI, Robert at Gradous, Greg at southern precision, Mike at Tac Ops, and Terry Cross at KMW all make phenomenal rifles.
Seems you are wanting a practical/tactical type rig? Or a benchrest rig?
Either way here we go.
Caliber
If you reload i suggest 6.5x47 Lapua first, 6.5 Creedmoor second, and .260 lastly. Nothing personal against the .260 it's actually the only one i own at the moment. The crux of it is the 6.5x47 can be pushed to similar results as the .260 and 6.5CM while burning 5gr less powder and the brass lasting much longer. Also the 6.5x47L is apparently fool proof to load for as it hammers in the accuracy department. Case design is very strong, and can handle decent pressure. Downside is that Lapua is the only supplier of brass and it's currently 113$/100. Also it uses a small rifle primer and some firing pins need to bushed to keep them from piercing or cratering primers.
6.5CM is the .260 done right IMHO. The longer neck and less steep shoulder angle allows seating the long 140s to mag length without seriously taking up powder capacity. Also factory ammo is readily available with 6.5CM it's not too hard to come by. Cons are if reloading, brass is narrowed to Hornady or Norma/Nosler of which the latter two are very high priced at 1.40$ a piece. It's to note Nosler/Norma does make exceptional brass. It's to note i say norma/nosler because i do know norma does manufacture some nosler brass for sure.
.260 while suffering from seating the long 140s to mag lengh and taking up powder capacities does have a good brass selection. Lapua, nosler, norma on the expensive side and Remington on the cheap side.
Ballistically they're all pretty much equal with the 6.5x47L falling slightly and i mean just slightly behind them. All of these cartridges will do the job and do it very well.
The Action
There are the remington 700 clones Defiance, Stiller, Surgeon, etc. That all roughly are machined one piece, integral lug, integral rail, one piece bolt, side bolt release, m16 extractor, fluted bolt, bolt knobs, etc. Prices can range from 950ish to 1400$. Most of the actions you see like SAC's proprietary, GAPs (minus the tempest), Gradous, Rbros, KMW, all have Defiance build them actions to their specs. Which speaks volumes about Defiance. Stiller does the same with some gun smiths as well as having won the Crane contract for the MK13. So they directly support our snipers with their TAC300 action, speaks for them as well. Surgeon has been in the game for a while as well though i don't have any provided examples like i do for the others. Though plenty of smiths use their actions GAP and KMW come to mind. I think it's become more difficult since they sold out.
There are the three lug actions, BAT, GAP tempest, and Badger M2013. Which besides the obvious 60 degree bolt lift and three locking lugs the differences aren't just inherently noticeable. The Tempest and m2013 use a removable breech ring, i'm not sure about the BAT. Associated downsides with three lug actions are cocking. Recocking the action after a fired shot is usually tough. I know there were many complaints of the m2008, i don't or can't really find much on the m2013. In the Tempest however this issue has been addressed, if you google it it will show George lifting the action with a finger.
Then there is the latest and greatest Mausingfield developed by Ted Karagias from American Rifle Company. Which is probably the most innovation or refinement rather bolt actions have seen in a long time. Ted took the Mauser 98 action and built upon it. It's very different from the others. It has control round feed, mauser claw extractor, springfield ejector, Toroidal locking lugs, tapered key rail mount, and from what i can tell it's smooth as silk. Also love the way the extractor rotates with the round so it doesn't shave into the rim of the brass. I will own one eventually. Only issue is they're 1600$. So a bit pricey at the moment.
There is always a Tikka which will save you some money as the don't have to be trued, come with a side bolt release, sako extractor, and a good trigger. All potential upgrades you'd do to a 700. Though the recoil lug needs to be replaced IMO as well as the bolt shroud. So that's some added expense. Downsides are you can't buy the action direct, they come in long action only, and Tikka is about to stop production of the T3. The way they use the actions for short action cartridges is a longer bolt stop to shorten the length of travel when cycling the bolt. If you can find a good deal on one say 425$ it's not a bad route to go. Tikkas also have a 70 degree bolt lift. Not quite 60 but not 90 like the 700/clones.
Then there is remington. Which you can use. All that really needs to be done is truing and then barrel it. 95% of people can't shoot the difference between a properly barreled 700 and a custom. Having said that some of the upgrades are desirable and resale value sucks for remingtons. Though you can get a blueprinted/trued one from PTG for about 550$
Barrel
Pick which ever you can find in stock, as long as the proper smith installs it you'll be fine.
Bartlein
Krieger
Rock Creek
Obermeyer
Broughton
Brux
Hart
Hawk Hill
etc. the list goes on.
Stock/Chassis
I went with a McMillan A5 for my build, nonadjustable ran me 700-750ish, 300$ bedding job, 400$ inlet job, so it came out pretty expensive. Manners the other big player in the stocks has a minichassis that you can use that comes with DBM that will save you money.
Chassis' which are what i'm going with on my Tempest build (specifically KRG Whiskey 3) are a little cheaper.
KRG
McCree
XLR
All make quality adjustable chassis'.
Optics
This is where i will differ some. I understand wanting to go with some great glass to start off. I started with a USO SN-3 and i do love it. Recently owned a Leupold mark 6, which i traded for a Bushnell ERS. I also own a Razor Gen II FWIW. I will say for the money the Bushnell HDMR, ERS, or XRS are hard to beat. The glass is very very clear, feature rich just like most 2000+ scopes, and from what i have seen they're dead on when it comes to tracking. Something i couldn't say for my 1700$ Mark 6. Which coincidentally was 6/10ths of a mil off at 10 mils at 100yds. Having owned and currently owning some premium glass i will say the ERS isn't really short coming at all. Don't get me wrong it isn't 2500$ glass but it is clearer than my Mark 4 M2 on my MK12. There is also the added fact that the used market is ridiculous for these scopes. You can get an ERS at 1050-1300$ on the used classfields at Snipershide. Second recommendation would be a vortex Gen I Razor, while they don't make them anymore Vortex has the best warranty in the business. You can find them used for 1300ish.
If you have any more questions feel free to pm me. Also here is a good read on getting started into LR shooting.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-equipment/
This is just kinda thought poured out on post, i'm definitely missing things here and there so i apologize in advance. It's late and i'm tired.
To answer up front about SAC, Madball they're good to go. Mark does phenomenal work. I wouldn't hesitate with going with him. Matter of fact, Mark at SAC, George at GAP, Chad at LRI, Robert at Gradous, Greg at southern precision, Mike at Tac Ops, and Terry Cross at KMW all make phenomenal rifles.
Seems you are wanting a practical/tactical type rig? Or a benchrest rig?
Either way here we go.
Caliber
If you reload i suggest 6.5x47 Lapua first, 6.5 Creedmoor second, and .260 lastly. Nothing personal against the .260 it's actually the only one i own at the moment. The crux of it is the 6.5x47 can be pushed to similar results as the .260 and 6.5CM while burning 5gr less powder and the brass lasting much longer. Also the 6.5x47L is apparently fool proof to load for as it hammers in the accuracy department. Case design is very strong, and can handle decent pressure. Downside is that Lapua is the only supplier of brass and it's currently 113$/100. Also it uses a small rifle primer and some firing pins need to bushed to keep them from piercing or cratering primers.
6.5CM is the .260 done right IMHO. The longer neck and less steep shoulder angle allows seating the long 140s to mag length without seriously taking up powder capacity. Also factory ammo is readily available with 6.5CM it's not too hard to come by. Cons are if reloading, brass is narrowed to Hornady or Norma/Nosler of which the latter two are very high priced at 1.40$ a piece. It's to note Nosler/Norma does make exceptional brass. It's to note i say norma/nosler because i do know norma does manufacture some nosler brass for sure.
.260 while suffering from seating the long 140s to mag lengh and taking up powder capacities does have a good brass selection. Lapua, nosler, norma on the expensive side and Remington on the cheap side.
Ballistically they're all pretty much equal with the 6.5x47L falling slightly and i mean just slightly behind them. All of these cartridges will do the job and do it very well.
The Action
There are the remington 700 clones Defiance, Stiller, Surgeon, etc. That all roughly are machined one piece, integral lug, integral rail, one piece bolt, side bolt release, m16 extractor, fluted bolt, bolt knobs, etc. Prices can range from 950ish to 1400$. Most of the actions you see like SAC's proprietary, GAPs (minus the tempest), Gradous, Rbros, KMW, all have Defiance build them actions to their specs. Which speaks volumes about Defiance. Stiller does the same with some gun smiths as well as having won the Crane contract for the MK13. So they directly support our snipers with their TAC300 action, speaks for them as well. Surgeon has been in the game for a while as well though i don't have any provided examples like i do for the others. Though plenty of smiths use their actions GAP and KMW come to mind. I think it's become more difficult since they sold out.
There are the three lug actions, BAT, GAP tempest, and Badger M2013. Which besides the obvious 60 degree bolt lift and three locking lugs the differences aren't just inherently noticeable. The Tempest and m2013 use a removable breech ring, i'm not sure about the BAT. Associated downsides with three lug actions are cocking. Recocking the action after a fired shot is usually tough. I know there were many complaints of the m2008, i don't or can't really find much on the m2013. In the Tempest however this issue has been addressed, if you google it it will show George lifting the action with a finger.
Then there is the latest and greatest Mausingfield developed by Ted Karagias from American Rifle Company. Which is probably the most innovation or refinement rather bolt actions have seen in a long time. Ted took the Mauser 98 action and built upon it. It's very different from the others. It has control round feed, mauser claw extractor, springfield ejector, Toroidal locking lugs, tapered key rail mount, and from what i can tell it's smooth as silk. Also love the way the extractor rotates with the round so it doesn't shave into the rim of the brass. I will own one eventually. Only issue is they're 1600$. So a bit pricey at the moment.
There is always a Tikka which will save you some money as the don't have to be trued, come with a side bolt release, sako extractor, and a good trigger. All potential upgrades you'd do to a 700. Though the recoil lug needs to be replaced IMO as well as the bolt shroud. So that's some added expense. Downsides are you can't buy the action direct, they come in long action only, and Tikka is about to stop production of the T3. The way they use the actions for short action cartridges is a longer bolt stop to shorten the length of travel when cycling the bolt. If you can find a good deal on one say 425$ it's not a bad route to go. Tikkas also have a 70 degree bolt lift. Not quite 60 but not 90 like the 700/clones.
Then there is remington. Which you can use. All that really needs to be done is truing and then barrel it. 95% of people can't shoot the difference between a properly barreled 700 and a custom. Having said that some of the upgrades are desirable and resale value sucks for remingtons. Though you can get a blueprinted/trued one from PTG for about 550$
Barrel
Pick which ever you can find in stock, as long as the proper smith installs it you'll be fine.
Bartlein
Krieger
Rock Creek
Obermeyer
Broughton
Brux
Hart
Hawk Hill
etc. the list goes on.
Stock/Chassis
I went with a McMillan A5 for my build, nonadjustable ran me 700-750ish, 300$ bedding job, 400$ inlet job, so it came out pretty expensive. Manners the other big player in the stocks has a minichassis that you can use that comes with DBM that will save you money.
Chassis' which are what i'm going with on my Tempest build (specifically KRG Whiskey 3) are a little cheaper.
KRG
McCree
XLR
All make quality adjustable chassis'.
Optics
This is where i will differ some. I understand wanting to go with some great glass to start off. I started with a USO SN-3 and i do love it. Recently owned a Leupold mark 6, which i traded for a Bushnell ERS. I also own a Razor Gen II FWIW. I will say for the money the Bushnell HDMR, ERS, or XRS are hard to beat. The glass is very very clear, feature rich just like most 2000+ scopes, and from what i have seen they're dead on when it comes to tracking. Something i couldn't say for my 1700$ Mark 6. Which coincidentally was 6/10ths of a mil off at 10 mils at 100yds. Having owned and currently owning some premium glass i will say the ERS isn't really short coming at all. Don't get me wrong it isn't 2500$ glass but it is clearer than my Mark 4 M2 on my MK12. There is also the added fact that the used market is ridiculous for these scopes. You can get an ERS at 1050-1300$ on the used classfields at Snipershide. Second recommendation would be a vortex Gen I Razor, while they don't make them anymore Vortex has the best warranty in the business. You can find them used for 1300ish.
If you have any more questions feel free to pm me. Also here is a good read on getting started into LR shooting.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-equipment/
This is just kinda thought poured out on post, i'm definitely missing things here and there so i apologize in advance. It's late and i'm tired.
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The real question is do you want to be shooting or do you want to be waiting? I'm not against going the full custom route, but you'll be waiting and not shooting unless you find a custom builder that happens to have a "ready to ship rifle" sitting on his shelf. Another thing is you're new to long range shooting and haven't figured out what works for you yet. Until you figure out what works for you, how do you know what you want in a custom rifle?
I just think that the faster you get to shooting the faster you get to learning. That's why I'm firmly in the camp buy a production rifle, put a good scope on it, buy a case of ammunition and hit the range. When you shoot up that case of ammunition buy another and keep shooting. When you shoot the barrel out on your production rifle you'll know what you want and that is when you go full on custom, or retube what has been working and keep putting lead down range.
I just think that the faster you get to shooting the faster you get to learning. That's why I'm firmly in the camp buy a production rifle, put a good scope on it, buy a case of ammunition and hit the range. When you shoot up that case of ammunition buy another and keep shooting. When you shoot the barrel out on your production rifle you'll know what you want and that is when you go full on custom, or retube what has been working and keep putting lead down range.
FWIW there is a stiller tac 30 A/W barreled action on the hide for 1300$. Has a bartlein heavy varmint 6.5 barrel with a 1:8 twist chambered in .260. Chambered by Greg at southern precision. Has 900-1000rds down the tube but it's in good shape. Doesn't come with a trigger but a timney 510 for 80$ and KRG X-Ray for 500-600$ and you'd be in the game.
Taylor is right about time behind the rifle and shooting. Having said that if you supply the parts for a custom rifle it wont be a six month wait at every smith, more like three months if i had to estimate. Also having said that i wouldn't do what i did if i had it to do over again. I wanted custom from the get go, people convinced me otherwise and now i have a 2500$ factory barreled action with extras. Main reason for going custom besides niceties is resale value. They will hold resale value like no doctored remington or Tikka could ever hope to. In that regard i'll likely go custom from here on out.
Taylor is right about time behind the rifle and shooting. Having said that if you supply the parts for a custom rifle it wont be a six month wait at every smith, more like three months if i had to estimate. Also having said that i wouldn't do what i did if i had it to do over again. I wanted custom from the get go, people convinced me otherwise and now i have a 2500$ factory barreled action with extras. Main reason for going custom besides niceties is resale value. They will hold resale value like no doctored remington or Tikka could ever hope to. In that regard i'll likely go custom from here on out.
You mean this Stiller Tac 30 AW with Bartlein barrel? It's a little over priced compared to what a new barrel and action costs. Especially since the seller is the second owner and truly doesn't know the round count. The guy with half heartedly offering $900 is actually closer to what the real price should be for a Krylon painted two owner barreled action.
Custom rifles never retain resale value, I don't know where you get that idea. Rifles like GAP, Gradous, and other similar companies offer are not usually offering custom rifles (they will if you pay even more), but full blown custom rifles aren't their bread and butter money makers. They offer production rifles plain and simple, and put together from an established blueprint and that's why they retain more value. They're more akin to a factory 350CI Chevy small block with bolt on performance parts.
Custom rifles never retain resale value, I don't know where you get that idea. Rifles like GAP, Gradous, and other similar companies offer are not usually offering custom rifles (they will if you pay even more), but full blown custom rifles aren't their bread and butter money makers. They offer production rifles plain and simple, and put together from an established blueprint and that's why they retain more value. They're more akin to a factory 350CI Chevy small block with bolt on performance parts.
1300 is 300$ cheaper than what it would cost new. 995$ for a stiller, 335$ for a bartlein and 300$ to install/chamber. Without at trigger. I agree it is a little overpriced, but it's not horrible, not great but not horrible. Whether 900rnds is rounds on the barrel is worth that discounted price is up to you.
And nothing retains it's retail value, but yes Customs retain much more resale value than a doctored 700. Look at the classfields and see how many people are paying premium for doctored 700s. From what i've seen they're still on sale. Much like the stiller. I couldn't get 2000$ for my 5R having put 2500$ into it.
And nothing retains it's retail value, but yes Customs retain much more resale value than a doctored 700. Look at the classfields and see how many people are paying premium for doctored 700s. From what i've seen they're still on sale. Much like the stiller. I couldn't get 2000$ for my 5R having put 2500$ into it.
4runnerman
New member
$300.00 cheaper then new for a barrel that has 1000 rounds down it?. Half barrel life is gone already. I rebarrel mine once a year and I tell you what-It cost's a heck of a lot more then $300.00 bucks to do it. If all your after is the Action and the Stock-Go for it, but to buy a Bench rifle that is half shot for 300.00 less then new is insane to say the least
Custom's retain their Value only because of the Action and Stock. The barrel is worthless. People buy them with the intent of rebarreling them asap.
Buy a Savage F Class- Shoot it till the barrel is shot. Very good action and a decent stock. Buy a custom barrel for it and your good to go.
Custom's retain their Value only because of the Action and Stock. The barrel is worthless. People buy them with the intent of rebarreling them asap.
Buy a Savage F Class- Shoot it till the barrel is shot. Very good action and a decent stock. Buy a custom barrel for it and your good to go.
I never said it cost 300$ to rebarrel a rifle. Smithing cost yes, plus the barrel no. There's a reason i said it isn't a great deal but not a horrible one either. Your still saving some money for another thousand rounds or so. 1100-1200 would be more preferable. And not everyone buys a used custom with the intent of rebarreling right away if the round count is low. That's a waste of a good barrel and a waste of money to begin with. I completely see your point if a barrel is well used. To act as if every custom has 1000s of rounds down the barrel is a little far fetched. There are guys who get into this sport then want something different and turn around and sell custom guns with less than 200rds down the tube.
If he wants a savage fine, but he specifically stated he can spend 5k. I don't see why he has to start with a production rifle if he doesn't want to. I mean if he just fired a firearm yesterday i'd agree but that apparently isn't the case.
If he wants a savage fine, but he specifically stated he can spend 5k. I don't see why he has to start with a production rifle if he doesn't want to. I mean if he just fired a firearm yesterday i'd agree but that apparently isn't the case.
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Agree.
Well put ... The O.P. should really go over to the Sniper's Hide board and check out the classified ads there. He'll find a lot of great long-range precision rifles getting sold there, including some GAP sticks.
Plus, on the 'Hide, he can read any number of informative posts from serious, experienced shooters who practice and compete in all sorts of long range matches on a regular basis with their pricey set-ups, not to mention reload for them too, and who actually know what they're talking about ...
Not so many "Sunday afternoon snipers" hanging out there, ... LOL
Yep, ... oh well, ...
Good luck to the O.P. with whatever choice you make.
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Unlicensed Dremel
Moderator
I'm no expert, but I'd just go to gunbroker.
Select Bolt Action Rifles.
Then add the term "custom" - there will be 12-13 pages, some of them VERY good values (and some not). Some are complete rigs with scopes; most do not come with scopes. You will likely get a LOT of rifle for half to 2/3rds of your budget. Obviously, the overbore chambering rifles are riskier as to remaining throat life, so factor in whether the bbl is long enough to turn down and still be as long as you want, and the cost of doing so.
Another good route is to have one of these specialist companies like GAP or Gunwerks or whathave you - build you the complete rifle. There are many good custom builders like this - I'd go with Proof Research in Columbia Falls MT with that budget if going that route - due to their carbon-fiber wrapped barrel.
But I would probably first decide the *general* weight/size you want: Light, medium-light, medium, medium-heavy, or heavy (i.e. is it ever going to be a real field rifle or not?). I prefer light or medium-light, because why not? You can still get outstanding accuracy and keep it light.
I would probably narrow you caliber down to two or three (6mm, 6.5mm, and 7mm are your best bets for the vast majority of long range stuff), and then narrow your chambering preferences down to about 6 or 8, something like that.
Finally, I would study this carefully:
http://precisionrifleblog.com/category/what-the-pros-use/
A 6mm chambering of some type seems to be the way to go out to around 1000-1200, but then maybe a 6.5 or 7mm if trying to go past 1250. Don't really need the insane recoiling stuff (.338s, .50s, .416s, .375 Cheytac, etc) unless and until you're trying insane distances - over 2000 yards.....OR if you want/need a lot of retained energy, like anti-materiel to 1000+.
Personally, if I had that cash, and I don't, I would have Proof Research build my "ultimate lightweight scout" which I have spoken of before, which is not really what people think of when they think precision rifle (this is more of a hunting rifle build), but just throwing it out there...
-Defiance Rebel action
-blind mag (no bottom metal)
-Bbl: .260 Rem, 21", 8.5 twist, from Rock Creek or whathaveyou; Proof carbon fiber wrap
-forward scope mount
-receiver cut out for stripper clips
-a "combo" sling of my own design
-Stock: problematic and custom, but a starting point would be a 90% CF fill manners MCS-SL or EH6, with refinements such as a trapdoor compartment in the bottom of the buttstock for one full stripper clip.
If I was building a heavier one for what you describe, it would be a medium-weight rig with 27" bbl in 7mm RSAUM or 7mm WSM.
Here are a few other top chambering choices for that purpose (with proper twist rates for longer bullets): 6XC, 6mmBR, 6x47mm, .243 win, .260 rem, .260 AI, 6.5 creedmoor, 6.5x47mm, 6.5-.284 Norma, 6.5x55 swede. If you're actually going to hunt large game with it, too, I'd tend toward a 6.5mm, 7mm, or .30 cal.... like 7mm WSM, 7mm RSAUM, .280 Rem, .280 AI, .284 Win, .300 WSM, .308 Norma mag, .308 Baer, or even .30-'06. OK, OK, here's the obligatory .308 win inclusion, but man oh man, how boring is that?
When in doubt, top it with some sort of Nightforce, and voila. If you'd have said $10K, I'd say US Optics or Schmidt and Bender instead.
YMMV
Select Bolt Action Rifles.
Then add the term "custom" - there will be 12-13 pages, some of them VERY good values (and some not). Some are complete rigs with scopes; most do not come with scopes. You will likely get a LOT of rifle for half to 2/3rds of your budget. Obviously, the overbore chambering rifles are riskier as to remaining throat life, so factor in whether the bbl is long enough to turn down and still be as long as you want, and the cost of doing so.
Another good route is to have one of these specialist companies like GAP or Gunwerks or whathave you - build you the complete rifle. There are many good custom builders like this - I'd go with Proof Research in Columbia Falls MT with that budget if going that route - due to their carbon-fiber wrapped barrel.
But I would probably first decide the *general* weight/size you want: Light, medium-light, medium, medium-heavy, or heavy (i.e. is it ever going to be a real field rifle or not?). I prefer light or medium-light, because why not? You can still get outstanding accuracy and keep it light.
I would probably narrow you caliber down to two or three (6mm, 6.5mm, and 7mm are your best bets for the vast majority of long range stuff), and then narrow your chambering preferences down to about 6 or 8, something like that.
Finally, I would study this carefully:
http://precisionrifleblog.com/category/what-the-pros-use/
A 6mm chambering of some type seems to be the way to go out to around 1000-1200, but then maybe a 6.5 or 7mm if trying to go past 1250. Don't really need the insane recoiling stuff (.338s, .50s, .416s, .375 Cheytac, etc) unless and until you're trying insane distances - over 2000 yards.....OR if you want/need a lot of retained energy, like anti-materiel to 1000+.
Personally, if I had that cash, and I don't, I would have Proof Research build my "ultimate lightweight scout" which I have spoken of before, which is not really what people think of when they think precision rifle (this is more of a hunting rifle build), but just throwing it out there...
-Defiance Rebel action
-blind mag (no bottom metal)
-Bbl: .260 Rem, 21", 8.5 twist, from Rock Creek or whathaveyou; Proof carbon fiber wrap
-forward scope mount
-receiver cut out for stripper clips
-a "combo" sling of my own design
-Stock: problematic and custom, but a starting point would be a 90% CF fill manners MCS-SL or EH6, with refinements such as a trapdoor compartment in the bottom of the buttstock for one full stripper clip.
If I was building a heavier one for what you describe, it would be a medium-weight rig with 27" bbl in 7mm RSAUM or 7mm WSM.
Here are a few other top chambering choices for that purpose (with proper twist rates for longer bullets): 6XC, 6mmBR, 6x47mm, .243 win, .260 rem, .260 AI, 6.5 creedmoor, 6.5x47mm, 6.5-.284 Norma, 6.5x55 swede. If you're actually going to hunt large game with it, too, I'd tend toward a 6.5mm, 7mm, or .30 cal.... like 7mm WSM, 7mm RSAUM, .280 Rem, .280 AI, .284 Win, .300 WSM, .308 Norma mag, .308 Baer, or even .30-'06. OK, OK, here's the obligatory .308 win inclusion, but man oh man, how boring is that?
When in doubt, top it with some sort of Nightforce, and voila. If you'd have said $10K, I'd say US Optics or Schmidt and Bender instead.
YMMV
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This was the OP's very first post where he clearly outlined his budget for rifle and optics.
In post #40 I asked you exactly how you would build a GAP rifle with optics for $5000? The basic GAP hunting rifle starts at $3000, and most of the precision rifles start over $4000. Same with Proof Research their basic rifle starts at $5800 and the majority are over $6000 without glass.
So explain to all of us "Sunday afternoon snipers" (mainly this wannabe sniper) how you plan to not go over the OP's original budget?
Madball6 said:
agtman said:
In post #40 I asked you exactly how you would build a GAP rifle with optics for $5000? The basic GAP hunting rifle starts at $3000, and most of the precision rifles start over $4000. Same with Proof Research their basic rifle starts at $5800 and the majority are over $6000 without glass.
So explain to all of us "Sunday afternoon snipers" (mainly this wannabe sniper) how you plan to not go over the OP's original budget?
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